Countries where Americans can study at universities, in English, for free(washingtonpost.com)
washingtonpost.com
Countries where Americans can study at universities, in English, for free
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/10/29/7-countries-where-americans-can-study-at-universities-in-english-for-free-or-almost-free/
18 comments
That's excellent, but it seems insane to not make this available for people with drug arrests.
I think insane is a pretty huge overstatement. It's stupid, sure, but not insane. And it's no more or less stupid than singling out any other specific crime.
Speeding? Jaywalking? Because that's the level of danger non-violent drug crimes present. To deny someone an education, something so valuable to not only their future but a value to society at large, over a minor crime is to cut off our nose to spite our face.
No lolligaggin'.
Insane, stupid, misguided -- pick your adjective.
A bad idea, let's agree :)
A bad idea, let's agree :)
[deleted]
I'm glad to hear that Georgia provides the scholarship. It is a pity that the state can't come up with a less regressive tax than the lottery.
Calling lotteries "tax" is only a cynical hyperbole; they are not actually a tax. People voluntarily play lotteries, whereas taxes are coerced. You do not face fines or jail time if you quit playing lotteries, like you do if you don't pay taxes. Being voluntary, lottery bets more closely resemble donations than taxes.
(Taxes on lottery winnings are a different story, of course; not talking about that here).
I'm appalled that you would suggest that it is better that people be coerced into paying for something which is adequately funded by "donations" through the lottery system.
(Taxes on lottery winnings are a different story, of course; not talking about that here).
I'm appalled that you would suggest that it is better that people be coerced into paying for something which is adequately funded by "donations" through the lottery system.
Agreed, call it a "tax" is entirely a condescending attitude:
"These poor folk who play the lottery only do it because they're intellectually inferior to me."
"These poor folk who play the lottery only do it because they're intellectually inferior to me."
"A fool and his money..." These people are going to manage their money poorly no matter what, and if you have a gambling prohibition you're going to just make it more dangerous for them. This seems like the best use of their citizen's need for gambling.
Coincidentally, that's how I justify my crack-dealing and murder-for-hire sidelines.
edit: If not from me, than from someone else, right? If that's not a vapid argument, you should be upvoting my entrepreneurship (even though it's in a well-trod space.) I also donate to open source projects...
edit: If not from me, than from someone else, right? If that's not a vapid argument, you should be upvoting my entrepreneurship (even though it's in a well-trod space.) I also donate to open source projects...
You're getting the downvotes, but I think you have a good point - at least the crack dealing bit; not so much the assassin part. I do find it morally suspect for the government to be in the gambling business. It's a cynical and lazy way to raise revenue.
The demographic that buys lottery tickets is largely die-hard anti-tax red that would never vote to fund education from raised taxes on anyone's income... a bit ironic when you think about it.
If that's true, it's not ironic. Buying a lottery ticket is a choice. Paying taxes imposed on the entire population is not a choice.
it isn't about gambling demographic, it is about voting demographic. To make the "salt of the earth holier than thou value" voters to vote for gambling you need to throw them a good cause they would thus supposedly support by their votes.
To call the lottery a tax is an insult to those who choose to play.
You sure thinned the ranks of 'anyone' quickly. Even legal residents of the USA from abroad face barriers because most other countries don't employ the US's grade point averaging system, but employ matriculation instead. If I hadn't lived here so long I wouldn't even know what a '3.0' referred to.
It sure beats nothing which is what a lot of other States provide over here.
Well true. I just reacted to it because it had a feeling of:
Free education for all!*
* not really
Sure, but the parent said anyone can get the scholarship, which is not true.
[deleted]
Yes, anyone in my state who qualifies.
When the bar is so low, it's not hard to beat it.
I assume that this is for in-state students only, all of whom should understand the grading system.
> Have a 3.0? Dont have any drug arrests or convictions?
The first two things are the reason why a lot of people I knew had to go to community college instead of directly to university. Florida has a similar program (Bright Futures) that has similar GPA requirements (and also community service and test scores). These programs are nice and all, but a far cry from actually making education beyond secondary school reachable for most people.
The first two things are the reason why a lot of people I knew had to go to community college instead of directly to university. Florida has a similar program (Bright Futures) that has similar GPA requirements (and also community service and test scores). These programs are nice and all, but a far cry from actually making education beyond secondary school reachable for most people.
I will make an unpopular statement, "college is not for everyone". The good news is not every one needs a college degree to succeed, even in this very field of software, college degree is "unessential". I am sure if the person below 3.0 GPA is passionate about learning and attaining college degree avenues should be open.
How's the in-state tuition for students who can't maintain a GPA in high school because they worked through it?
Is a university really an appropriate place to send someone who couldn't keep up with high school coursework, whatever the reason, in the first place? At the very least, wouldn't we need some kind of preparatory education in between? There may be exceptions but I think it'd be hard for universities to evaluate if they are academically qualified.
As an aside, I know of several states that have similar programs - I'd thought that in many states, so long as you scored sufficiently high on the SAT or ACT, you were eligible to automatically get a partial (if lower) or full (if higher) scholarship to in-state public institutions.
As an aside, I know of several states that have similar programs - I'd thought that in many states, so long as you scored sufficiently high on the SAT or ACT, you were eligible to automatically get a partial (if lower) or full (if higher) scholarship to in-state public institutions.
>Is a university really an appropriate place to send someone who couldn't keep up with high school coursework, whatever the reason, in the first place?
A really good question. I'd say the US does a very poor job of either providing that preparatory edu for those who need it or guiding those who fall out of the educational system into trade schools and other vocations, something that Germany also does very well. Not sure what the solution is for the US... we're so focused on the people at the top and the bottom that everyone else is left out.
A really good question. I'd say the US does a very poor job of either providing that preparatory edu for those who need it or guiding those who fall out of the educational system into trade schools and other vocations, something that Germany also does very well. Not sure what the solution is for the US... we're so focused on the people at the top and the bottom that everyone else is left out.
For what it's worth, most programs really can't assume much about incoming classes having a solid background, so there is a lot of remedial effort in first year anyway.
So yes, if you were basically competent but didn't put the time in in highschool, for whatever reason, then sure - if you're willing to do the work no reason they can't succeed.
And given that high schools are such a mixed bag, I do think it's worth at least looking at giving more kids a shot. It might be interesting to have a slate of such scholarships reserved for students who wouldn't qualify on entry, but would after first semester/year.
Which isn't to say everyone should go, I really wish there were more real vocational options. But if they want it and can do the work, absolutely.
So yes, if you were basically competent but didn't put the time in in highschool, for whatever reason, then sure - if you're willing to do the work no reason they can't succeed.
And given that high schools are such a mixed bag, I do think it's worth at least looking at giving more kids a shot. It might be interesting to have a slate of such scholarships reserved for students who wouldn't qualify on entry, but would after first semester/year.
Which isn't to say everyone should go, I really wish there were more real vocational options. But if they want it and can do the work, absolutely.
Georgia has a good way of dealing with this as well. As recently as a few years ago(they made some recent changes, I'm not sure about now) you could go to a college, get a 3.0 GPA and become eligible for the scholarships. There is also a fantastic exchange program that allows academically late bloomers to transfer to better schools once they start performing better. Both of my brothers took advantage of these means. They both transferred from community colleges to Georgia Tech from community colleges once they got their act together.( and both ended up graduating with highest honors and with less than 10k in debt) If you are that confident you are capable of college but werent able to prov it in high school, i think having to put up a years worth of costs before the state will help you out is a good gatekeeper to making sure only those for whom that is actually the case benefit from the system. At a minimum, it raises the stakes of you succeeding.
That sounds like a good program.
This seems an odd one to be "downvoted", enough so I'm curious why. I wouldn't have noticed except it changes the font color.
For most schools its around 3,000-4,500 a semester for about 12-18 hours. Community college cost a little bit less but not by much (GaTech, Kennesaw State, Ga State, Ga Perimeter College)
Our largest school, University of Georgia, its a bit more. Something like $10,000 a semester but the tuition is the same at each school the fees are much higher at UGA.
*Georgia Tech - I am not 100% on tuition/fees for this school.
I feel you on the working while in school thing, thats the reason I lost my Hope Scholarship!
Our largest school, University of Georgia, its a bit more. Something like $10,000 a semester but the tuition is the same at each school the fees are much higher at UGA.
*Georgia Tech - I am not 100% on tuition/fees for this school.
I feel you on the working while in school thing, thats the reason I lost my Hope Scholarship!
Louisiana has a similar program. If you have a 2.5 GPA and at least a 20 on the ACT, your in-state tuition is paid for (for the base award). You can also qualify for an additional stipend for having higher GPA/ACT scores.
Myself and many of my friends got our degrees with $0 debt.
http://www.osfa.state.la.us/MainSitePDFs/TOPS_OPH_brochure_8...
Myself and many of my friends got our degrees with $0 debt.
http://www.osfa.state.la.us/MainSitePDFs/TOPS_OPH_brochure_8...
I had a 2.8 in high school, didn't get Hope, and ended up in community college. It's not as trivial as you make it out to be, honestly.
Interestingly, a report came out a couple of years ago recommending it be changed to a 2.5 minimum and a $100k income cap[1], to broaden access to lower-income students. Didn't happen, though.
[1] http://gbpi.org/hope-on-a-tightrope
Interestingly, a report came out a couple of years ago recommending it be changed to a 2.5 minimum and a $100k income cap[1], to broaden access to lower-income students. Didn't happen, though.
[1] http://gbpi.org/hope-on-a-tightrope
Doesn't sound too great for the (disproportionately black and poor) victims of the drug war...
Considering that 2 out of the 4 largest schools here have more African Americans than any group, I would say it sounds great.
That statistic is meaningless without a description of the demographics of Georgia, the quality (rather than size) of the schools, and a comparison between the communities in which these schools are each located.
For example: if all black people in Georgia interested in higher education were forced to attend the two worst quality and most underresourced schools, they would probably rank amongst the largest.
For example: if all black people in Georgia interested in higher education were forced to attend the two worst quality and most underresourced schools, they would probably rank amongst the largest.
[deleted]
w-t-agenda?
Note that the grading systems in most European countries are very different from the one in USA: We use the whole range. No "B is ok, A is good". Here A is mostly excellent, and C is an acceptable grade to get. It's good to keep in mind when researching our universities. So you don't get put off if the acceptance grades are low or if the average grade is low.
It's weird going the other way (from Europe to USA). They told us we couldn't continue the studies if we got below B-, and we were like "???".
It's weird going the other way (from Europe to USA). They told us we couldn't continue the studies if we got below B-, and we were like "???".
I'd like to remark that there's a similar trend that seems to go on in high schools and with college admissions. By all accounts, I've heard that it's not too difficult to attain perfect high-school grades (save for some of the very competitive high schools), whereas that's usually a serious achievement in European schools. There's a similar comparison for the AP vs. IB examinations.
[deleted]
Concerning France:
> Public university programs charge only a small tuition fee of about 200 dollars for most programs.
Public universities are indeed very cheap and they tend to offer more and more English programs to attract foreign students. However, they're usually not prestigious as there is very little selection to get in. The brightest students usually follow a different path.
> Other, more elite institutions have adopted a model that requires students to pay fees that are based on the income of their parents.
I think they refer to business schools which are mainly private and more expensive. However, the best scientific schools are public (and pretty much free) but there are very specific admission conditions, and teaching is mostly done in French.
> Public university programs charge only a small tuition fee of about 200 dollars for most programs.
Public universities are indeed very cheap and they tend to offer more and more English programs to attract foreign students. However, they're usually not prestigious as there is very little selection to get in. The brightest students usually follow a different path.
> Other, more elite institutions have adopted a model that requires students to pay fees that are based on the income of their parents.
I think they refer to business schools which are mainly private and more expensive. However, the best scientific schools are public (and pretty much free) but there are very specific admission conditions, and teaching is mostly done in French.
This comment is very true, but I would like to add that if the public Universities have quite a bad reputation for the first two or three years, the level of the Msc (in France it's 5 years of University) is decent, and still free.
Bear in mind that positions in international rankings mean almost nothing, as most of them are calculated by looking at the number of cross-linked papers from a university to judge its final score. That immediately puts non-English speaking universities at a huge disadvantage, and I would argue that top-level universities of each country are at pretty much same level despite their ranking positions.
That immediately puts non-English speaking universities at a huge disadvantage
How so? I studied at University of Amsterdam, everyone spoke English at graduate level and everyone published in English. Many faculty where not even Dutch. I would expect the same from any international class university.
How so? I studied at University of Amsterdam, everyone spoke English at graduate level and everyone published in English. Many faculty where not even Dutch. I would expect the same from any international class university.
>>and everyone published in English.
I really doubt that. I am sure we can both provide anecdotal evidence, but there is no way 100% of papers are published in English. And you picked a very specific example, because an overwhelming majority of Dutch people speak English at a very good level.
I really doubt that. I am sure we can both provide anecdotal evidence, but there is no way 100% of papers are published in English. And you picked a very specific example, because an overwhelming majority of Dutch people speak English at a very good level.
So a tuition-free Masters in Mathematics in Germany sounds pretty intriguing. Has anyone here studied in the German system as an expat? What was your experience? Is it feasible?
I have attended Berlin Mathematical School, a joint program by the three renowned universities from Berlin. The program is specifically set up for foreign students and is absolutely feasible for foreigners!
www.math-berlin.de
Currently finishing up my Master's in CS at a German school, Saarland University. The town the school is in (Saarbrücken, near Luxembourg) is extremely dull, especially with my rather poor German skills, but the education I'm getting is top-notch, and you can't argue with the price.
Anything you're wondering about specifically?
Anything you're wondering about specifically?
I can't speak for myself since I'm German, but e.g. at the university and technical university in Hamburg there are lots of foreign students who seem to enjoy themselves :) I do not have any hard numbers at hand, though.
What are the living costs for a student couple in Germany? I'd really like to learn German and want to get a Masters degree soon. I could work while studying if I find a job.
I live in a WG (a group rents a flat or a house and everyone gets a room, common kitchen and bathroom) and spend around 600€/month including health insurance (you need that, 70€/month, don't know about foreigners).
Depending on the city, it's harder or easier to live on that because rent can differ a lot. (200-400€/room, I pay 250€.)
edit: To clarify - the university requires you to have health insurance, but there is a special tariff for students. Students below 25 are mostly covered by their parent's insurance here, after that you need to cover yourself.
edit: To clarify - the university requires you to have health insurance, but there is a special tariff for students. Students below 25 are mostly covered by their parent's insurance here, after that you need to cover yourself.
As a foreigner in Germany I can confirm the 70€/month is for foreigners as well (on a student visa)
I'm an expat and just finished an english language masters program in engineering in Germany. It is feasible. Combining grad level studies, language studies, and part-time work can be a bit overwhelming at times. If you could avoid the part-time work, I'd recommend it. There are a lot of differences in the German education system that take a little adaptation.
I don't know about the other countries, but the author has left out some important conditions about Brazil's universities. I checked on the two he listed to confirm, but most public universities in Brazil have similar rules.
They are tuition free for students who are accepted based on a standardized test given in Portuguese called the vestibular. This test, similar to the SAT in the US, is the entire basis of admission. Students choose a major, then take the vestibular. Public universities will have X slots available for each major. If T = the total amount of students taking the test who chose the same major, then you would be accepted if you scored better than (T-X) other students of your same major. The article seems to imply you don't need to know the native language to study there tuition free. In this case it's simply not true.
The other way an English speaker could be permitted to study at those universities is through an exchange program from a university where one is likely already paying a tuition. Even then, exchange students are only permitted to study for up to a year.
Last, the tuition may be free, but the dorm conditions in Brazilian universities that have them are pretty dismal to my knowledge. Most students live off campus, so room and board would likely still be a pretty big expense.
They are tuition free for students who are accepted based on a standardized test given in Portuguese called the vestibular. This test, similar to the SAT in the US, is the entire basis of admission. Students choose a major, then take the vestibular. Public universities will have X slots available for each major. If T = the total amount of students taking the test who chose the same major, then you would be accepted if you scored better than (T-X) other students of your same major. The article seems to imply you don't need to know the native language to study there tuition free. In this case it's simply not true.
The other way an English speaker could be permitted to study at those universities is through an exchange program from a university where one is likely already paying a tuition. Even then, exchange students are only permitted to study for up to a year.
Last, the tuition may be free, but the dorm conditions in Brazilian universities that have them are pretty dismal to my knowledge. Most students live off campus, so room and board would likely still be a pretty big expense.
I'm very sceptical of this.
For example I just picked Lund University in Sweden. No it's not free. It's $15K a year. [1] The University of Helsinki is indeed free though. [2]
In case of Germany, the entry requirements are quite hard. Not impossible but hard enough that many Germans end up studying in neighbouring countries because they cannot get in a German university for some courses were there is competition.
Also If you go on course aggregation websites and filter for English you will get like a hundred courses taught in English, but then you realise that they are mostly humanities. It's much harder to find English taught natural science BSc programmes.
1. http://www.lunduniversity.lu.se/lubas/i-uoh-lu-NGNAT-FYSI/tu... 2. http://www.helsinki.fi/studying/fees_and_costs.shtml
For example I just picked Lund University in Sweden. No it's not free. It's $15K a year. [1] The University of Helsinki is indeed free though. [2]
In case of Germany, the entry requirements are quite hard. Not impossible but hard enough that many Germans end up studying in neighbouring countries because they cannot get in a German university for some courses were there is competition.
Also If you go on course aggregation websites and filter for English you will get like a hundred courses taught in English, but then you realise that they are mostly humanities. It's much harder to find English taught natural science BSc programmes.
1. http://www.lunduniversity.lu.se/lubas/i-uoh-lu-NGNAT-FYSI/tu... 2. http://www.helsinki.fi/studying/fees_and_costs.shtml
The article explicitly mentions that only PhD studies are free in Sweden (for non-EU citizens).
To say that PhD studies in Sweden (and the rest of the Nordics) are free is a bit of a mdisnomer though. PhD students in the Nordics are bona fide paid employees, and the salary is a perfectly de3cent public sector wage (that is, more than enough to live on).
If people are considering this, let me throw out another option: antwerp, belgium.
Tuition isn't free, but affordable. Around 3000 euro per year for non-EU students (subsidized through taxation). Admission requirements are not strict. When i was studying CS we had a few foreign students and accomodations were made for them so they could study in english. Living costs are reasonable, lower than london, amsterdam or paris. The city itself is very international. We have more nationalities living here than live in New York. Most people speak english, and in fact i have a ukrainian coworker who isn't even bothering to learn dutch because english is sufficient. You can be in amsterdam or paris in two hours, and cheap travel to anywhere in europe is available. The city has a rich history and culture. You can drink beer in bars which are half a millenium old, and visit buildings which were centuries old when columbus discovered the americas.
In fact, even if you don't come to study, come anyway, for a vacation :)
Tuition isn't free, but affordable. Around 3000 euro per year for non-EU students (subsidized through taxation). Admission requirements are not strict. When i was studying CS we had a few foreign students and accomodations were made for them so they could study in english. Living costs are reasonable, lower than london, amsterdam or paris. The city itself is very international. We have more nationalities living here than live in New York. Most people speak english, and in fact i have a ukrainian coworker who isn't even bothering to learn dutch because english is sufficient. You can be in amsterdam or paris in two hours, and cheap travel to anywhere in europe is available. The city has a rich history and culture. You can drink beer in bars which are half a millenium old, and visit buildings which were centuries old when columbus discovered the americas.
In fact, even if you don't come to study, come anyway, for a vacation :)
Article is correct in general, though very wrong in details.
Yes, you can study (not for free) but cheap (for like 3000 dol. a year). If you want to study for free you need to learn the language. If you learn the language, there will be a special governmental scholarship granted to those American (or any foriegn students).
Brazil has free education if you study in portuguese. There are much more countries not mentioned that also have free education for foriegners.
Germany is very difficult country to study. Very compatative even for Germans. The foriegn students will be accepted only after German. Admission to programs is different from US and difficult.
Brazil has free education if you study in portuguese. There are much more countries not mentioned that also have free education for foriegners.
Germany is very difficult country to study. Very compatative even for Germans. The foriegn students will be accepted only after German. Admission to programs is different from US and difficult.
TL;DR: Germany, Finland, France, Sweden, Norway, Slovenia, Brazil.
When it comes to Norway, be aware that the Government has proposed the introduction of tuition fees for international students outside the EU / EEA despite a unanimous Parliament that said no to this under a year ago. [0]
[0] http://isu-norway.no/blog/
[0] http://isu-norway.no/blog/
Same goes for Finland, just today the government announced plans to introduce 4,000 €/year tuition fee for non-EU (EEA) citizens starting from 2016: http://yle.fi/uutiset/tuition_fees_planned_for_non-eea_stude...
I'm really interested in this. Especially Germany. Do any one of you have a link handy for me to see the good Universities in Germany? Please? Thx
Basically, all state universities have a good level of teaching, it doesn't matter where you go on the undergrad level. Later, your field is important; universities have different specializations. Some people prefer smaller universities (more intimate teaching), others bigger universities (more different lectures - more choice). If you only know English, it limits your choices of course.
So start with the subject you want to study, or with the kind of city you want to live in. Do you want to live in a big city or a small city? Do you prefer a big university? What's your level - do you need general teaching or do you want to get into specialities? In the first case, any university that offers the course is fine, in the second, look closer.
So start with the subject you want to study, or with the kind of city you want to live in. Do you want to live in a big city or a small city? Do you prefer a big university? What's your level - do you need general teaching or do you want to get into specialities? In the first case, any university that offers the course is fine, in the second, look closer.
I grew up in Germany, but studied in Holland.
As far as I know, all universities in Germany are more or less equivalent. In Germany no one will ask what university you went to, when you apply for a job. Unless it's an applied university (Fachhochschuhle).
With that in mind, I would recommend you to choose your mayor first and then figure out which university has English speaking programs for that mayor. In Germany you have to choose your mayor before you apply to University.
As far as I know, all universities in Germany are more or less equivalent. In Germany no one will ask what university you went to, when you apply for a job. Unless it's an applied university (Fachhochschuhle).
With that in mind, I would recommend you to choose your mayor first and then figure out which university has English speaking programs for that mayor. In Germany you have to choose your mayor before you apply to University.
http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-ranki...
if you like seeing your universities in ranking form
if you like seeing your universities in ranking form
there is a really good page if you are interested in Studying in Germany. https://www.study-in.de/en/
This is very interesting, as I expect my next or next+1 move to be seeking a PhD in computer science. My wife and I are open to the idea of living in Europe.
Does anyone care to comment on Germany or Scandinavia for computer science programs at the PhD level?
Does anyone care to comment on Germany or Scandinavia for computer science programs at the PhD level?
So what are the requirements for these programs? Are there GPA averages, background, personality requirements? Or can I just fly over there present my GED and register for a semester?
German here, studied CS at 4 German universities.
No idea about your visa, but if you are enrolled somewhere that shouldn't be a problem.
Application process: will vary widely, for many human sciences you can just enroll (Sociology, History, Gender Studies, all that stuff). You might even be able to just enroll for Business in some places.
For CS degrees sometimes you have to apply formally and show what projects you have done, submit your grade sheet, sometimes interviews. For my M.Sc. I was allowed to interview via Skype because I was abroad at the time. They gave me proper coding and interview questions and grilled me for 45mins. Some proof of A-Levels will be required.
Living costs: Will vary depending on where you go. Berlin will be dead cheap, so will be many places in the former GDR, while southern cities like Munich or Stuttgart will be more expensive. Hamburg is also fairly expensive. Nothing like the Bay Area or NY though.
A very nice resource for German Universities is: http://ranking.zeit.de/che2014/en/
No idea about the other mentioned countries, but I was surprised that Scotland didn't show up, but they might be only free for non-english EU citizens.
No idea about your visa, but if you are enrolled somewhere that shouldn't be a problem.
Application process: will vary widely, for many human sciences you can just enroll (Sociology, History, Gender Studies, all that stuff). You might even be able to just enroll for Business in some places.
For CS degrees sometimes you have to apply formally and show what projects you have done, submit your grade sheet, sometimes interviews. For my M.Sc. I was allowed to interview via Skype because I was abroad at the time. They gave me proper coding and interview questions and grilled me for 45mins. Some proof of A-Levels will be required.
Living costs: Will vary depending on where you go. Berlin will be dead cheap, so will be many places in the former GDR, while southern cities like Munich or Stuttgart will be more expensive. Hamburg is also fairly expensive. Nothing like the Bay Area or NY though.
A very nice resource for German Universities is: http://ranking.zeit.de/che2014/en/
No idea about the other mentioned countries, but I was surprised that Scotland didn't show up, but they might be only free for non-english EU citizens.
Just get in contact with the admission officers. They will give you instructions on what you should do to become eligible. For example, they might request you to attend community college to get some credits such as Calc I to Calc III and give you a conditional offer. Once you get your credits you are admitted.
Not free but cheap, mostly founded by the USA; Middle East Technical University. One of the best 100 universities in the world.
> Middle East Technical University. One of the best 100 universities in the world.
According to which ranking?
Does not appear at top 500 in the Shanghai list ranking: http://www.shanghairanking.com/ARWU2014.html
According to which ranking?
Does not appear at top 500 in the Shanghai list ranking: http://www.shanghairanking.com/ARWU2014.html
#85 on the Times Higher Education ranking [1].
#164 on the new US News international ranking [2].
Around #400 on the QS rankings [3].
[1] http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-ranki...
[2] http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/page/local/us-news-global-t...
[3] http://www.topuniversities.com/university-rankings/world-uni...
#164 on the new US News international ranking [2].
Around #400 on the QS rankings [3].
[1] http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-ranki...
[2] http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/page/local/us-news-global-t...
[3] http://www.topuniversities.com/university-rankings/world-uni...
In 60. In 2013. http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-ranki...
This year is in 100 too.
The education language is English. The campus is located in Ankara. Designed by Americans, during cold war, in shape of a gun, pointing Moscow.
This year is in 100 too.
The education language is English. The campus is located in Ankara. Designed by Americans, during cold war, in shape of a gun, pointing Moscow.
Canada could be a good option for many people. International tuition fees can be competitive with in-state tuition at public US universities. There are also funded masters degrees in some disciplines, which is extremely rare in the US.
My program was 22k/y to foreign students. And that was 10 years ago. Don't forget that tuition is 75% subsided.
Looks like you're right. My experience in a graduate program doesn't extrapolate to undergrad. Just looked this up: international undergrad tuition at UBC is about $24k and international graduate tuition is about $7.5k.
Edit: to further clarify, it appears that graduate rate is only for "research" graduate programs. "Professional" programs can be much more.
Edit: to further clarify, it appears that graduate rate is only for "research" graduate programs. "Professional" programs can be much more.
FREE is relative and you need to do the cost benefit analysis.
The advantage of professor connections of Columbia U. to
Wall Street and consulting vs. Stanford U to Silicon Valley
MUST BE EMPHASIZED. However, who knows where your
journey will take you.
1 don't have kids, so HN are we 'related like family'?
2 rhetorical question
3 Go to a middle level college, borrow student debt and
4 BE A WAGE SLAVE FOR LIFE. BE A WAGE SLAVE FOR LIFE.
5 YOUR LIFE CHOICES, IMHO
6 1.) middle level college - NO 7 2.) Stanford or Columbia U because they have 8 plenty of scholarships. 9 2b.) avoid Cooper Union, NYC. Although with 10 zero tuition for now, THEY ARE BANKRUPT.
11 3.)low level college, cheap community and 12 learn how to weld. Then, get a job for 13 $200 thousand per year in the fracking 14 oil industry. Boss chooses between a middle 15 level 'state college' and C grade at top college, 16 I PREFER THE top college.
17 http://www.alternet.org/education/looking-escape- 18 high-cost-college-these-7-countries-will-educate-you-free 19 insert the missing countries and the URL for the 20 calculator as to DETERMINE YOUR LIFE COURSE.
21 Oh, me? I chose #2 with very little student debt. 22 Thanks friends for letting me doing the illegal 23 apt roomie thing at Columbia Engineering. 24 Perfect for me, as I was not as 'hard-core geek' 25 as M.I.T.
26 1.) Germany. the problem is that you must think in 27 Math AND GERMAN. No exceptions. Key advantage is 28 the real deal the Chaos Club makes Defcon look like wimps. 27 Math AND GERMAN. No exceptions. Key advantage is 28 the real deal the Chaos Club makes Defcon look like wimps. 29 German practicality places this as a higher choice.
30 2.)Finland. Some of the strangest friends I have ever known. 31 Lack of sun and Vitamin D means most as well as you will be 32 depressed. Cheer up with the better than Poland math skills. 33 Easy to get a job on Wall Street.
34 3.)Why avoid Poland? World War III ring side seat with Russia, 35 Poland, Ukraine, etc.
36 4.)France. Spend most of the time eating and dating. Much more 37 woman friendly and family friendly by MANY MEASURES. 38 Forget about manufacturing expertise, but the cryptography/math 39 seems to rock.
40 5. Norway: We LOVE the freezing cold and time spent on oil rigs. 41 The minature Germany, except for lack of good beer.
42 6. Slovenia: Skype and other software starts in Eastern Europe 43 or the former USSR.
44 7. Sweden: Could be a one way trip to Sweden. Good for learning 45 communitarian and cooperative work process, which is not taught 46 in the USA. 47 this is not in order. mileage will vary greatly.
48 8.) Brazil. Untold wealth and you too can play anthropologist/ 49 miner in the Amazon jungle. Assumes you live to tell the tale. 50 The sugar/ethanol industry means they are an oil wealth producer. 51 More effective chemical engineering than US ethanol 52 relying on 'king corn.' 53 9.)China. Third world poverty country with billionaires. 54 Like Brazil, likely the best way to become a billionaire, 55 unless you are a math genius. Teaching English while doing school 56 could be an exercise in sleep deprivation. 57 Plenty of entrepreneurs, unlike Germany. Due to the 'culture' 58 or German beer vs Chinese 'stinky socks' mao-tai? 59 hey Asians, I am Asian. Please do not flame me.
60 10.)Russia. Included for political incorrectness. Likely a 61 one-way ticket, since Russia is on the present enemies lists. 62 But if you are into nuclear engineering or natural gas pipelines, 63 for they are building the world's largest ...
64 11.) Florida, listed as 'separate country' Do the work program 65 at the yacht club and get a backer for the Donut franchise. 66 Donut franchise creates millionaires (for select few)
82 12.) Gaming the system? Women who got some money apply to Barnard 83 College. Major in basket weaving or physical education. 84 Take all the worthwhile courses like business, egineering at 85 Colubmia University, which cross lists courses.
86 After all you want a great experience and REAL education, 87 not a fake piece of paper, right HN? 88 bon voyage from old man Odysseus.
6 1.) middle level college - NO 7 2.) Stanford or Columbia U because they have 8 plenty of scholarships. 9 2b.) avoid Cooper Union, NYC. Although with 10 zero tuition for now, THEY ARE BANKRUPT.
11 3.)low level college, cheap community and 12 learn how to weld. Then, get a job for 13 $200 thousand per year in the fracking 14 oil industry. Boss chooses between a middle 15 level 'state college' and C grade at top college, 16 I PREFER THE top college.
17 http://www.alternet.org/education/looking-escape- 18 high-cost-college-these-7-countries-will-educate-you-free 19 insert the missing countries and the URL for the 20 calculator as to DETERMINE YOUR LIFE COURSE.
21 Oh, me? I chose #2 with very little student debt. 22 Thanks friends for letting me doing the illegal 23 apt roomie thing at Columbia Engineering. 24 Perfect for me, as I was not as 'hard-core geek' 25 as M.I.T.
26 1.) Germany. the problem is that you must think in 27 Math AND GERMAN. No exceptions. Key advantage is 28 the real deal the Chaos Club makes Defcon look like wimps. 27 Math AND GERMAN. No exceptions. Key advantage is 28 the real deal the Chaos Club makes Defcon look like wimps. 29 German practicality places this as a higher choice.
30 2.)Finland. Some of the strangest friends I have ever known. 31 Lack of sun and Vitamin D means most as well as you will be 32 depressed. Cheer up with the better than Poland math skills. 33 Easy to get a job on Wall Street.
34 3.)Why avoid Poland? World War III ring side seat with Russia, 35 Poland, Ukraine, etc.
36 4.)France. Spend most of the time eating and dating. Much more 37 woman friendly and family friendly by MANY MEASURES. 38 Forget about manufacturing expertise, but the cryptography/math 39 seems to rock.
40 5. Norway: We LOVE the freezing cold and time spent on oil rigs. 41 The minature Germany, except for lack of good beer.
42 6. Slovenia: Skype and other software starts in Eastern Europe 43 or the former USSR.
44 7. Sweden: Could be a one way trip to Sweden. Good for learning 45 communitarian and cooperative work process, which is not taught 46 in the USA. 47 this is not in order. mileage will vary greatly.
48 8.) Brazil. Untold wealth and you too can play anthropologist/ 49 miner in the Amazon jungle. Assumes you live to tell the tale. 50 The sugar/ethanol industry means they are an oil wealth producer. 51 More effective chemical engineering than US ethanol 52 relying on 'king corn.' 53 9.)China. Third world poverty country with billionaires. 54 Like Brazil, likely the best way to become a billionaire, 55 unless you are a math genius. Teaching English while doing school 56 could be an exercise in sleep deprivation. 57 Plenty of entrepreneurs, unlike Germany. Due to the 'culture' 58 or German beer vs Chinese 'stinky socks' mao-tai? 59 hey Asians, I am Asian. Please do not flame me.
60 10.)Russia. Included for political incorrectness. Likely a 61 one-way ticket, since Russia is on the present enemies lists. 62 But if you are into nuclear engineering or natural gas pipelines, 63 for they are building the world's largest ...
64 11.) Florida, listed as 'separate country' Do the work program 65 at the yacht club and get a backer for the Donut franchise. 66 Donut franchise creates millionaires (for select few)
82 12.) Gaming the system? Women who got some money apply to Barnard 83 College. Major in basket weaving or physical education. 84 Take all the worthwhile courses like business, egineering at 85 Colubmia University, which cross lists courses.
86 After all you want a great experience and REAL education, 87 not a fake piece of paper, right HN? 88 bon voyage from old man Odysseus.
Is America one of them because if you go to any state school (better than most schools in the rest of the world) and you dont have enough income you pretty much get a full ride + stipend.
That's simply not true. I'm the oldest of 6 kids. Plenty of state school attendance between myself and my siblings, and neither us nor our parents were ever able to just pay for school each year.
We've all gotten the best local scholarship from our high school so far (4/4), most of us got additional scholarships, and also some aid from the school.
All of us have had to take out loans.
EDIT: Going a bit further, I went to school in-state, and the semester I spent abroad in a world class city was cheaper than a semester staying in central Illinois.
We've all gotten the best local scholarship from our high school so far (4/4), most of us got additional scholarships, and also some aid from the school.
All of us have had to take out loans.
EDIT: Going a bit further, I went to school in-state, and the semester I spent abroad in a world class city was cheaper than a semester staying in central Illinois.
All depends where you are. I know plenty of kids that get paid to go to community college using various programs.
You already know this but University and Community College are not the same thing, and they don't offer the same things.
Even throwing that out as a valid alternative simply continues the position of only those who have money are worthy of getting knowledge.
Even throwing that out as a valid alternative simply continues the position of only those who have money are worthy of getting knowledge.
You can go to a community college for two years and then transfer to a four-year university, which will generally save substantial amounts of money.
This is actually a bit of a boondoggle, because your university will either not recognize your community college credits, or they will have their own requirements likely to be incompatible with the credits you took at community college, leaving those first two years basically wasted. So you get to pay for 2 years at a community college, then 4 years at a university. That's not saving money.
Hell, it might not even work to transfer from one university to another! I transferred after 2 years at a satellite campus of Penn State (where the curriculum is identical to the main campus) to a state school, stayed in Computer Science, and had to cram 4 years of CS at that school into 3 years just to be able to cut some of my losses because apparently taking intro to CS at a school that does it in C means you have to take it over again in a school that does it in Java.
Hell, it might not even work to transfer from one university to another! I transferred after 2 years at a satellite campus of Penn State (where the curriculum is identical to the main campus) to a state school, stayed in Computer Science, and had to cram 4 years of CS at that school into 3 years just to be able to cut some of my losses because apparently taking intro to CS at a school that does it in C means you have to take it over again in a school that does it in Java.
> This is actually a bit of a boondoggle, because your university will either not recognize your community college credits, or they will have their own requirements likely to be incompatible with the credits you took at community college, leaving those first two years basically wasted.
Well, you certainly can't do it willy-nilly - you need to have a idea of where you're going after community college and what your major is. Generally, most community colleges work with local universities to ensure that their programs will transfer wholesale if you take the prescribed courses, which do not necessarily match up with what the community college recommends for other students.
I have indeed heard a lot of horror stories about transferring credits in general between universities or colleges - if the institutions don't have a relationship that keeps transfer students in mind it seems you're pretty much boned.
I did this, following community college direction, and all my courses transferred and I wasn't set back at all, though I was highly front-loaded on general education rather than CS-specific courses. At the time community college tuition and fees was $800/semester, while university tuition and fees was $5000/semester. That would have been a substantial savings! As it was, I really lost money, because I would have qualified for a full scholarship to my university academically anyway, but I lost it since transferred in and ended up paying the next three years (one year of grad school) out of my minimum-wage-earning pocket.
Well, you certainly can't do it willy-nilly - you need to have a idea of where you're going after community college and what your major is. Generally, most community colleges work with local universities to ensure that their programs will transfer wholesale if you take the prescribed courses, which do not necessarily match up with what the community college recommends for other students.
I have indeed heard a lot of horror stories about transferring credits in general between universities or colleges - if the institutions don't have a relationship that keeps transfer students in mind it seems you're pretty much boned.
I did this, following community college direction, and all my courses transferred and I wasn't set back at all, though I was highly front-loaded on general education rather than CS-specific courses. At the time community college tuition and fees was $800/semester, while university tuition and fees was $5000/semester. That would have been a substantial savings! As it was, I really lost money, because I would have qualified for a full scholarship to my university academically anyway, but I lost it since transferred in and ended up paying the next three years (one year of grad school) out of my minimum-wage-earning pocket.
I was supposed to be able to transfer with no problems, as I was supposedly going between two "state system" schools in a supported degree program. My degree program was designed to be completed in four years, and the class schedule was built around that. Certain required classes just weren't offered every year, and they were prerequisites for other such classes. If you didn't start on the right beat, you were off schedule and couldn't get all of your requirements taken care of in 4 years.
Another way to work it is CLEP tests. If they don't accept a transfer credit for ... american history or whatever, but you took the class, and they do accept CLEP tests and those aren't terribly hard... Note there are exam fees and transfer fees to consider, usually nominal.
My personal experience at a couple schools is the smaller the school the more often exceptions will be granted. Or maybe rephrased across all sizes of school the (someone) will grant 10 exceptions per year and maybe 1% of students will try to get an exception, which is awesome odds if its a 500 person private college, not so awesome odds at a larger 5K person school. So even if on paper, calculus won't transfer, if you make a bit of a pest of yourself the dean or dept chair will eventually sign off. Also you can game the system, OK you won't accept my calculus transfer credits, very well, I will get instructor permission to take diffeqs without pre-reqs and when I pass diffeqs I will petition the dept head yet again for calc credit.
My personal experience at a couple schools is the smaller the school the more often exceptions will be granted. Or maybe rephrased across all sizes of school the (someone) will grant 10 exceptions per year and maybe 1% of students will try to get an exception, which is awesome odds if its a 500 person private college, not so awesome odds at a larger 5K person school. So even if on paper, calculus won't transfer, if you make a bit of a pest of yourself the dean or dept chair will eventually sign off. Also you can game the system, OK you won't accept my calculus transfer credits, very well, I will get instructor permission to take diffeqs without pre-reqs and when I pass diffeqs I will petition the dept head yet again for calc credit.
This is true, but generally aid and scholarships aren't enough to cover costs for one full year, let alone two. Many students will take out loans because of this.
Community college isn't equivalent to the schools being discussed here though. The point of the article is big, 4-year institutions, and the comment I was replying to specifically mentioned the state schools as being better than international universities.
Yup. I think part of the problem is that Americans group together "Universities", "Colleges" and "schools" as "schools". In the rest of the world you leave "school" after High School and make a conscious decision to go to a college or to university. It's pretty clear that they provide different syllabi.
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Actually, rich private schools tend to provide better financial aid--provided you can get in. Several years back, Harvard completely eliminated tuition for middle-class households: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aElmj...
Many other wealthy elite institutions have followed suit.
Many other wealthy elite institutions have followed suit.
There are really not very many middle class students at these elite institutions.
I'd be interested to see if you could provide a reference for that statement. My experience with undergraduates I've met at MIT and Harvard, for example has been that they are predominantly middle class - however with still predominantly more upper class students than working class. Of course, that's just my subjective impression.
The bulk of Ivy League undergraduates come from white-collar professional families. You can quibble about whether that's "upper middle-class" or "middle-class", I suppose, but you don't find most of them at the yacht club.
Interesting. I studied low at Harvard for two years in the middle 80s. Around 75% of my colleagues were from "yacht club" families. Maybe the things have changed since.
Harvard Law school is very different from Harvard undergrad. I'm sure it skews even more highly toward the rich-daddy set.
yeah, sure sarcarsm
state school in Kansas or Utah is better that Humboldt University of Berlin or Sorbonne University. Do not flatter yourself.
There are good schools in USA but you can not say that state schools are better than most schools in the rest of the world. It just shows that you as narrow minded and knowing nothing about the world. You do not want to be perceived like this, do you?
> of you go to any state school (better than most schools in the rest of the world) and you dont have enough income you pretty much get a full ride + stipend.
My state school is like $300M in debt. If you don't have enough income, you take out student loans and hope the in-state tuition makes it bearable.
My state school is like $300M in debt. If you don't have enough income, you take out student loans and hope the in-state tuition makes it bearable.
This is definitely true in some cases, although I think the article was trying to only include places without the income restriction.
In my case, I got two associates degrees essentially free: I had a scholarship that covered all but about $3000 my first year. The second year, my parents income had dropped to the point where government grants kicked in - the grants not only covered the remainder of my tuition, but also gave me about $3000 in stipends.
In my case, I got two associates degrees essentially free: I had a scholarship that covered all but about $3000 my first year. The second year, my parents income had dropped to the point where government grants kicked in - the grants not only covered the remainder of my tuition, but also gave me about $3000 in stipends.
Have a 3.0? Dont have any drug arrests or convictions? Legal resident of Georgia/USA?
Then all of your tuition will be paid by the state unless you drop below a 3.0. The lottery is what funds this scholarship and its really great.