Ask HN: What do you think of my MVP for a simple expense tracking web app?(dollarlog.com)
dollarlog.com
Ask HN: What do you think of my MVP for a simple expense tracking web app?
http://dollarlog.com/?utm_source=hackernews&utm_medium=hn_post&utm_campaign=ask_hn
17 comments
Well I can tell you what I didn't like from the moment I saw the web page: I can't see or use the app in any way before I even register. As some random visitor coming to your site, why would I bother doing that, when I have no idea what to expect from signing-up (other than a bunch of words on a page, which I just skipped looking for the app screenshots/demo).
The biggest suggestion I could offer would be to give your potential customers a reason to use it - ask them a question on the conversion page that qualifies them as a customer - i.e. "Want to spend your money more effectively?" or "Want to cut down on the amount of time you spend tracking corporate expenses?" or something similar. As is, the site kinda assumes that everyone has the problem you are trying to solve, which has the affect of making it appeal to "no one". Be more explicit about the problem you'd like to solve in your copy and it will boost user confidence immensely and get many more of them to the point where they will want to try your service.
also, reach out to the frugal/debt community- there are lots of bloggers who'll happily do reviews to help their readers, and it's a lot of good publicity.
1) Where is the privacy policy, data usage, and terms of service?
2) What makes this different from Expensify or Mint?
2) What makes this different from Expensify or Mint?
I like it! Very simple and easy to use.
Since I don't have any expenses I have to track for accounting purposes, I'm looking at this as a tool to track my own expenditure so as to help improve my spending habits. I realise the focus might be different so my suggestion may be useless to you!
What would be really useful to me would be reminders and notifications. With developing habits like this, I have a very hard time unless I'm constantly reminded. Like I take my lunch on weekdays at 12pm, so a reminder at half 12 or 1 would have me enter my lunch expenses. This could be further enhanced if you had a mobile app that used push notifications. This would be essential for me to develop the habit of doing it.
Since I don't have any expenses I have to track for accounting purposes, I'm looking at this as a tool to track my own expenditure so as to help improve my spending habits. I realise the focus might be different so my suggestion may be useless to you!
What would be really useful to me would be reminders and notifications. With developing habits like this, I have a very hard time unless I'm constantly reminded. Like I take my lunch on weekdays at 12pm, so a reminder at half 12 or 1 would have me enter my lunch expenses. This could be further enhanced if you had a mobile app that used push notifications. This would be essential for me to develop the habit of doing it.
Ah thanks for the suggestions. That's something I've been thinking about a bit, I think it's a pain to enter expenses all the time. How do you feel about an email reminder in place of a push notification?
Email reminders could also work well.
My thinking with mobile push notifications would be you tap the notification and it takes you straight to a simple UI where you punch in the values.
It might be harder to reduce the friction as low as this with email notifications but it could work just as well. A simple link could work, or one step further is having a feature where you can specify expenditure and tags in the reply to an email in a certain format that's parsed by your app e.g:
$8, work, commuting $4.50, lunch
(Values in example may seem low because I'm British but dollar/pound symbol is neither here nor there in this case!)
My thinking with mobile push notifications would be you tap the notification and it takes you straight to a simple UI where you punch in the values.
It might be harder to reduce the friction as low as this with email notifications but it could work just as well. A simple link could work, or one step further is having a feature where you can specify expenditure and tags in the reply to an email in a certain format that's parsed by your app e.g:
$8, work, commuting $4.50, lunch
(Values in example may seem low because I'm British but dollar/pound symbol is neither here nor there in this case!)
Ultimately I would love to do a mobile app and it really wouldn't be that difficult to build, I guess I just wanted to gauge interest before dedicating more time. That's a really interesting suggestion about the email reply, I'm going to think about that a bit more!
I'd like to reply to my email with the expense and then tags on separate lines beneath it.
* -> email.
* -> email.
Congrats for creating such a simple (but useful!) tool for the masses. I have found some bugs however:
- If I enter a nonnumeric value in the expense field it doesn't complain but enters the detail as 0$ and tag details. It would create some mishap in the mobile devices.
- If I enter a numeric value and don't fill the tag and explanation fields the system reenters last valid value. For example if I entered $1234 and home as the tag it will repeat if I enter 200 for the amount and erased the autofilled home tag.
- There isn't a way to delete/edit previous entries. I should be able to delete them at least...
Apart from these little stuff the system rocks. :) Keep up the good work, mate.
- If I enter a nonnumeric value in the expense field it doesn't complain but enters the detail as 0$ and tag details. It would create some mishap in the mobile devices.
- If I enter a numeric value and don't fill the tag and explanation fields the system reenters last valid value. For example if I entered $1234 and home as the tag it will repeat if I enter 200 for the amount and erased the autofilled home tag.
- There isn't a way to delete/edit previous entries. I should be able to delete them at least...
Apart from these little stuff the system rocks. :) Keep up the good work, mate.
Cheers!Deletion and bug fixes are definitely coming!
First of all, I want to congratulate you for actually shipping, and dare show it here on Hacker News.
However, I can't consider this an MVP. Sure it is minimal, but it is barely usable as it is right now. I'd like a datepicker, instead of writing the date by hand, and I'd like to be able to have a suggestion of tags I used in the past. I'd like to have the enter key submit the form. Such small details that would add great value.
Moreover, I expected the Day, Week, Month filter to show me only the expenses in that time frame, instead of just the total changing.
Keep it up! Very good job overall.
However, I can't consider this an MVP. Sure it is minimal, but it is barely usable as it is right now. I'd like a datepicker, instead of writing the date by hand, and I'd like to be able to have a suggestion of tags I used in the past. I'd like to have the enter key submit the form. Such small details that would add great value.
Moreover, I expected the Day, Week, Month filter to show me only the expenses in that time frame, instead of just the total changing.
Keep it up! Very good job overall.
Thanks very much! I definitely agree with you. All of this stuff is really easy to add in and will be there in the coming days.
Is there any way to preview it? At the very least some screenshots that show the user what the web app can do would be very helpful. :)
I've added a few small screenshots to the homepage for now. I'll definitely do a better preview in the coming days!
Had this problem recently and solved it by creating a Google Drive form connected to a spreadsheet, saving what expense and how much it was. Then bookmarked the form on my iPhone homescreen. Nice to have a secret url for collecting data without having to authenticate or anything. Something similar could probably be useful here too.
I really like the simplicity of it. Keep it clean and simple and people will use it forever.
BUT,
there are some basic features missing, such as: currency config (Europeans have Internet too ;), subject & comment notes. A receipt upload would be really great too. Plus, as much as I love Bootstrap, please invest $15 in a custom theme ;)
Nice job!
BUT,
there are some basic features missing, such as: currency config (Europeans have Internet too ;), subject & comment notes. A receipt upload would be really great too. Plus, as much as I love Bootstrap, please invest $15 in a custom theme ;)
Nice job!
I use mint.com, but I really have a problem with the method of how they receive data. I believe banks should provide API keys for their customers which allows read-only access to their accounts.
Unfortunately, their is zero interest within banks to build this.
Edit: I do too many transactions to use something like this or Toshl.
Unfortunately, their is zero interest within banks to build this.
Edit: I do too many transactions to use something like this or Toshl.
I had a few problems with Mint which is why I decided to build this: 1. It wasn't available in my country and 2. I didn't want to connect my bank account, just because I wasn't comfortable with giving them that info. The API key would be awesome, but with banks being such large organisations that deal with so much data I feel like this would be almost impossible to implement with their current systems.
I hear ya!
I work for a big bank, and I tried pushing the idea around a bit, but to no avail.
It really comes down to "business need" - the department responsible for the online services would need to be convinced that there is a desire and a benefit to providing an API key. I imagine they would see it negative for two ways - added risk by having sites/programs connect to their application, and they won't see the added benefit to customers, and vice-versa - customers wouldn't really know what to do with the key.
It would take a player like Mint to make that case - they could do branding with a major bank such that they are the first to safely share data, but then recommend products, etc.
I work for a big bank, and I tried pushing the idea around a bit, but to no avail.
It really comes down to "business need" - the department responsible for the online services would need to be convinced that there is a desire and a benefit to providing an API key. I imagine they would see it negative for two ways - added risk by having sites/programs connect to their application, and they won't see the added benefit to customers, and vice-versa - customers wouldn't really know what to do with the key.
It would take a player like Mint to make that case - they could do branding with a major bank such that they are the first to safely share data, but then recommend products, etc.
It's a nice start. Well done!
I want to click on the tags that I have used so far, so that I can see a summary for that tag, but it doesn't seem to do anything.
Entering the amounts on mobile could be improved if you could popup a number keypad on focus. And a calendar select couldn't hurt either.
Again, well done!
I want to click on the tags that I have used so far, so that I can see a summary for that tag, but it doesn't seem to do anything.
Entering the amounts on mobile could be improved if you could popup a number keypad on focus. And a calendar select couldn't hurt either.
Again, well done!
Filtering by tags is coming soon! It's almost done, just putting the finishing touches on it. Thanks for the suggestions! How would you feel about a paid premium service that gave more analytics around spending habits?
I think enhanced analytics would be very valuable to your users. In fact, without it you don't really have a product.
BTW: I think that this the sort of service where Freemium doesn't make sense. You need people to get value out of the system, not offer them some crippled version for free and hope they will upgrade.
With this sort of service it is best to offer everything with a generous trial period.
Once someone has their data in your system they will want to pay you when the time comes as they have invested their time to get their data into your system. But getting people to convert will depend on whether you are offering them true value, and this can be best achieved by exposing all the value from the start.
BTW: I think that this the sort of service where Freemium doesn't make sense. You need people to get value out of the system, not offer them some crippled version for free and hope they will upgrade.
With this sort of service it is best to offer everything with a generous trial period.
Once someone has their data in your system they will want to pay you when the time comes as they have invested their time to get their data into your system. But getting people to convert will depend on whether you are offering them true value, and this can be best achieved by exposing all the value from the start.
I'm inclined to agree on the freemium thing. I may have an issue though when it comes to getting existing users on the free system to move over to a paid model. Do I grandfather existing users or force them to move?
Yeah, some products lend themselves to an obvious upgrade path (like my own where increased usage brings charges). When you find yourself in this situation it makes sense to offer a free tier as a gateway. We also get some (small) promotional value from our free users as well. But for your product it's not obvious that having free users will provide you with much value and if they don't transition to paid, then they are very much a dead weight.
That said, having people as free users and then cutting them off without warning could have a negative PR effect.
I think the easiest course of action is to put some wording in a prominent place on the site to the effect of "this is a free beta, but we will be moving to a paid model when we feel we are providing enough value". Then when the time comes, it won't come as a surprise. Then you put them on the 30/60/X day free trial (which you have anyway for new paid users) and they can transition.
Sure, you will lose some of those free users along the way, but unless they are providing value to you, free users are just going to be a drain on your limited resources.
That said, having people as free users and then cutting them off without warning could have a negative PR effect.
I think the easiest course of action is to put some wording in a prominent place on the site to the effect of "this is a free beta, but we will be moving to a paid model when we feel we are providing enough value". Then when the time comes, it won't come as a surprise. Then you put them on the 30/60/X day free trial (which you have anyway for new paid users) and they can transition.
Sure, you will lose some of those free users along the way, but unless they are providing value to you, free users are just going to be a drain on your limited resources.
Is there any way to see what I'm signing up for without actually signing up for it?
I've added a couple of small screenshots to the home page for the time being! Hopefully that helps a little.
Great starting point. Do you have a hypothesis about who would benefit from such a product? It may help you with next steps to validate the concept.
The market I'd really think that would benefit from this (at least early on) is University students. Obviously, it isn't only limited to this, but in general uni students are generally making smaller purchases relatively often.
It is good that you have a narrow focus. What specific problem do university students have that is solved by your product? Also, have you thought about how you want to iterate with a small group of users?
The problem is that often, a lot of University students are extremely unaware of how much they spend. I would argue more so than people that are more experienced handling their expenses. The amount of my friends that have said to me 'Man, I have no idea where my money goes, I don't but anything, but it just goes!' is crazy. If I can empower Uni students to make better financial decisions through a better understanding of their expenses.
Changing behavior is difficult. That's the reason services like mint rely on bank/credit card transactions to get the data. You may want to quickly start testing with a few university students before investing more development time.
Does it sync with online accounting software like Freeagent?
Nope, I guess the idea at this point was to keep it simple as possible. Is that a feature that you would be interested in using?
Essential for me! Understand that complicates things though.
Hm, interesting. How would you see a product like mine working with some kind of existing service like Freeagent?
Already apps that do it, look at Mobile Agent
I would love if this could integrate with YNAB somehow
I like the simplicity, but there are a LOT of bugs.
Add some features to set budgets, track total expenditure and work out how much you've got left.
I think a lot of people would like to see what the app might look like before giving away their email address.