Jquerymy.js – Purely declarative apps with complex two-way data-binding(jquerymy.com)
jquerymy.com
Jquerymy.js – Purely declarative apps with complex two-way data-binding
http://jquerymy.com/
9 comments
I find the description of this confusing. I feel like there's a number of people who talk about programming in a way that I'm not familiar with. Where do people learn verbiage like this? Is it popular among some universities? Is there something beyond code complete and gof?
For example, I've never gotten a good handle on what other people see as declarative. I know the definition and I know my interpretation - but other people's interpretations seem to lead to very slightly different sets of declarative things. Is the term really not strongly defined?
I think my main grappling with this (such as "two way data binding") is that they are generally things that aren't that hard, I just didn't know there was a name behind it. Then when I see someone describe it, it takes me embarrassingly long to figure out that it's something I've done for a decade.
Do other people experience this?
edit: I noticed a downvote. I don't intend this to be off-topic or irreverent. My apologies.
For example, I've never gotten a good handle on what other people see as declarative. I know the definition and I know my interpretation - but other people's interpretations seem to lead to very slightly different sets of declarative things. Is the term really not strongly defined?
I think my main grappling with this (such as "two way data binding") is that they are generally things that aren't that hard, I just didn't know there was a name behind it. Then when I see someone describe it, it takes me embarrassingly long to figure out that it's something I've done for a decade.
Do other people experience this?
edit: I noticed a downvote. I don't intend this to be off-topic or irreverent. My apologies.
Yes. People seem to form communities, isolate themselves, and rename things.
In my (not that long) career I've used .Net, Cocoa, Python + Django, Go, Ruby + Rails, Clojure, JavaScript. The same things crop up again and again, with quite a variety of different names.
Truth is, if you've understood a named concept you'll see that it's the concept as something differently named elsewhere. You just have to tell yourself that humans will be humans.
Some of these things, like Apple's Class Clusters in Core Foundation are understandable because they were probably pioneering uses / rediscoveries of particular design patterns which got named before the Gang of Four came along.
And some of them are just plain ridiculous. The Ember people refer to JavaScript objects as hashes (presumably because of their Ruby background) and that's particularly annoying.
In my (not that long) career I've used .Net, Cocoa, Python + Django, Go, Ruby + Rails, Clojure, JavaScript. The same things crop up again and again, with quite a variety of different names.
Truth is, if you've understood a named concept you'll see that it's the concept as something differently named elsewhere. You just have to tell yourself that humans will be humans.
Some of these things, like Apple's Class Clusters in Core Foundation are understandable because they were probably pioneering uses / rediscoveries of particular design patterns which got named before the Gang of Four came along.
And some of them are just plain ridiculous. The Ember people refer to JavaScript objects as hashes (presumably because of their Ruby background) and that's particularly annoying.
I'm glad you brought up ember! I found it very confusing (and I have 5 years of ruby). I don't know what kind of approach I need for success there.
I met people who had only been programming under a year who were more successful with it ... and I have been doing Javascript since the 90s.
I wish I could unlearn all the things that create this mental blockage for me ... but I've been unable to overcome them. I don't know what to do - I feel like I'm missing out on a pretty lively movement.
I feel like I need to approach ember, angular et al as if "ok pretend that this isn't javascript. Pretend that it's something new." Because honestly they don't treat the language like the scheme-self hybrid I've become so familiar with.[1]
I think that approach will help, but I just don't have the discipline to be successful at it.
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1. It's like with C++ how there's basically two kinds of devs ... the C-programmer who discovered some nifty organizational techniques, and then the C++ programmer. The second C++ programmer writes code that the other one finds very odd and confusing and the first one doesn't understand why anyone would go through all that trouble to do something that ought to be so simple, in her mind.
I met people who had only been programming under a year who were more successful with it ... and I have been doing Javascript since the 90s.
I wish I could unlearn all the things that create this mental blockage for me ... but I've been unable to overcome them. I don't know what to do - I feel like I'm missing out on a pretty lively movement.
I feel like I need to approach ember, angular et al as if "ok pretend that this isn't javascript. Pretend that it's something new." Because honestly they don't treat the language like the scheme-self hybrid I've become so familiar with.[1]
I think that approach will help, but I just don't have the discipline to be successful at it.
----
1. It's like with C++ how there's basically two kinds of devs ... the C-programmer who discovered some nifty organizational techniques, and then the C++ programmer. The second C++ programmer writes code that the other one finds very odd and confusing and the first one doesn't understand why anyone would go through all that trouble to do something that ought to be so simple, in her mind.
I had a good go at Angular. I felt like it as a decent framework with interesting concepts. I built an app with it.
Next project I thought I'd try Ember. It's very much my way or the highway. Huge amounts stuff learn. Not only concepts, but all those conventions. Very narrowly scoped models to which the whole world will conform (it doesn't, not without tying yourself in knots). The same thing that really puts me off Rails.
I ditched Ember for the project and now I'm using React which I picked up in an hour and it's brilliant.
YMMV. But I can't stand arrogance, and, to my mind, Ember drips with it. That includes renaming things that already have names.
Next project I thought I'd try Ember. It's very much my way or the highway. Huge amounts stuff learn. Not only concepts, but all those conventions. Very narrowly scoped models to which the whole world will conform (it doesn't, not without tying yourself in knots). The same thing that really puts me off Rails.
I ditched Ember for the project and now I'm using React which I picked up in an hour and it's brilliant.
YMMV. But I can't stand arrogance, and, to my mind, Ember drips with it. That includes renaming things that already have names.
One thing that many of these techs do is take one primitive, such as a function, and then call it half a dozen different things - making it look like there's a difference.
I understand the goals of such an exercise, but I'm not convinced that it leads to quicker to deploy, easier to maintain, simpler to modify software.
I think they must have different goals in mind when they write code - a lot of people clearly love the stuff. I just don't know what these goals are.
I understand the goals of such an exercise, but I'm not convinced that it leads to quicker to deploy, easier to maintain, simpler to modify software.
I think they must have different goals in mind when they write code - a lot of people clearly love the stuff. I just don't know what these goals are.
Well... I did not use word "declarative" anywhere at jquerymy.com – but if someone think $.my manifests are declarative, I understand why.
Can you tell, why do you think this syntax is not declarative? What is your interpretation?
Can you tell, why do you think this syntax is not declarative? What is your interpretation?
Many people on this thread like it and you shouldn't feel obliged to deviate from your goals for the project because of me. Thanks for working on this and I wish you the best.
I really liked your comment, but I'm still curious about what is your definition of "declarative".
I've used knockout.js for a few years now on multiple projects. As knockout grows, I started to dream of a library that would provide me with a two-way data binding. But not only between data object and DOM, but between data objects itself, like ko.computed does.
This seems like a nice solution, although like other commentators mentioned, the lag seems to be quite unbearable. So it might be just something towards right path and hopefully it will be maintained and updated to work more smoothly, but wont grow into full framework.
This seems like a nice solution, although like other commentators mentioned, the lag seems to be quite unbearable. So it might be just something towards right path and hopefully it will be maintained and updated to work more smoothly, but wont grow into full framework.
I use knockout.js at work and like it quite a bit. But I think that I've found what you're looking for, or something close to it, in Reactive Extensions. It's a free library available for many languages including JS. With it you can compose UI interactions, promises, and other arbitrary events in an FRP-like way using observers. An example probably explains it best: http://jsfiddle.net/nmd88wum/
If that piques your interest, check out: https://gist.github.com/staltz/868e7e9bc2a7b8c1f754
If that piques your interest, check out: https://gist.github.com/staltz/868e7e9bc2a7b8c1f754
Have you looked at Vue?
http://vuejs.org/api/options.html#computed
http://vuejs.org/api/options.html#computed
computed: {
foo: function () {
return this.a + this.b;
},
bar: function () {
return this.foo + this.zot;
}
}Looks great but I feel like there is quite a bit of latency
Seems the latency is somewhat intentional in some of the examples as they make use of the "delay" feature of the plugin: http://jquerymy.com/api.html#CW-delayed-bi
See for instance the code of the map:
See for instance the code of the map:
ui: { //The loupe itself
"#loupe":{
recalc:"#json",
delay:1,
...
{
id:"en.Bezier",
params: {delay:10},
...Especially on the drag+zoom map. There was terrible lag. It seems like the way you were doing this before is still the better way to do it, at least for now.
Promising project though. If they can fix the latency issues, it'd be something I'd use.
Promising project though. If they can fix the latency issues, it'd be something I'd use.
Well, it‘s a DOM animation lag mostly. Thanks for your point althouth.
This looks really neat, as it allows me to use this feature for small parts of my project, instead of forcing me into a whole framework and changing every aspect of my application accordingly.
My two questions for all JavaScript libraries as an enterprise LoB dev are:
(1) What browser versions are supported? (Translation: are you willing to do/accept help with the work to support business users?)
Edit: answered at the bottom, IE9+
(2) How well is deep nesting supported? (Translation: can my parent-child-grandchild-greatgrandchild piles of data entry forms use this?)
Thanks for the time invested in creating this library and the associated documentation!
(1) What browser versions are supported? (Translation: are you willing to do/accept help with the work to support business users?)
Edit: answered at the bottom, IE9+
(2) How well is deep nesting supported? (Translation: can my parent-child-grandchild-greatgrandchild piles of data entry forms use this?)
Thanks for the time invested in creating this library and the associated documentation!
1) In fact, versions up to 1.0 supported IE8. Think current version also support, although it was not tested in IE8.
To mention – $.my is heavily and primarily used in biz environment for very complex backends.
2) Forms can even be recursive. http://cloudwall.me/etc/json-editor.html – you can check youself how deep source json and associated forms can go and find out when it will stall )
2) Forms can even be recursive. http://cloudwall.me/etc/json-editor.html – you can check youself how deep source json and associated forms can go and find out when it will stall )
I really like this one, but i am concerned by performance.
Have tests been done on that?
I don't know, but probably not.
Anyway, you can see some basic apps in action at http://cloudwall.me/
Anyway, you can see some basic apps in action at http://cloudwall.me/
You can try cloudwall.me on iPad to be convinced )
What's the advantage of using this over something like angular.js?
You can not use one Angular app inside other without side effects and tuning. So Angular app in general can not be a control (like input or select) for another app.
$.my apps behave like complex controls – you can enclose one $.my app into other, you even can make this enclosure recursive (for example http://cloudwall.me/etc/json-editor.html).
Also since $.my manifests are JSON docs, you can combine them just attaching one manifest as a property of another manifest – so app of nearly any complexity can exist as a single JSON.
$.my apps behave like complex controls – you can enclose one $.my app into other, you even can make this enclosure recursive (for example http://cloudwall.me/etc/json-editor.html).
Also since $.my manifests are JSON docs, you can combine them just attaching one manifest as a property of another manifest – so app of nearly any complexity can exist as a single JSON.
This seems like it would be more lightweight flexible than something like angular. With angular you have to do everything with data attributes (which is fine for a lot of use cases) but this can be done in all js with "normal" HTML.
This looks kind of neat, although I'm pretty happy with Angular for this purpose for now.
- Simple, interactive example at the top.
- Short, ~150 word technical explication.
- Five detailed demos that are all different.
- Detailed list of controls.
Obviously, not every project lends itself to this type of information architecture, but I'd love to see more projects think as hard about their presentation as this one does.