Where do you work? because in every developer/engineer job I've worked over the past 12 years, in corproate, academic, small business and startup environments, hostility, foul language, heated arguments and even implications of violence run amok. When/if it is appropriate is a delicate and tricky balancing act that requires careful judgement (which is sometimes misplaced), and the nuances are such that no policy (or lack of policy) can adequately accommodate them.
I'm not an expert on government and law, but it is my understanding that due process is rooted in the recognition that circumstances are often more nuanced than laws can accommodate, and so evaluation of the circumstances are necessary for every case.
I'm not saying OSI actions should follow the same due process as criminal courts, but my point is no, saying the things he said at countless companies, corporations, environments, under some context or another, would not result in firing.
How is this reply from Josh Berkus NOT doing exactly what he accuses ESR of doing?? A directed attack on a person's character riddled with accusations and assumptions about their motive but entirely void of response to any of the points or topics the person brought up, and a dismissive, alienating assertion that the person makes no contribution or adds any value, and their absence will not be felt?
Seems like an attempt to intimidate an opponent and win an argument by making the opponent afraid (or banned) to participate
>>> ESR's “sharp language” is not an attempt to persuade. It is an attempt to intimidate opponents; to “win” an argument by making others afraid to participate. Indeed, even today OSI mailing list composition is entirely folks with enough privilege to be resistant to personal attacks. That's a sad, terrible thing.
It's not “free speech” when it's an attempt to shout others down so that they have no voice. It's something else entirely.
Further, not one of ESR's points is original or even original to this list. In his absence, not one of the ideas he so “colorfully” expressed will be lost. In the meantime, we're missing the input of so many people who will not participate in OSI because of our tolerance for wholly uncivilized behavior like his posts.
The Wire? umm no need to turn to racist generalizations. Not really sure what a tv show about heroin trafficking has to do with this, but keep your stereotypes at bay.
And you didn't address any point other than the diction in my delivery, so way to stay relevant, with your ad hominem, non sequitur, fallacious remark.
For your info, I wasn't referring to the author with the interjection. Get some culture.
i don't care what race you are, i don't like people who feel entitled to things. life is a motherfuckin bitch, grow up.
as far as the whole black/white thing, black people definitely still have to deal with the racism of past and present, and it's in our social structure and political structures and legal structures and economic structures and on and on. i certainly acknowledge it, but i still can't help but be annoyed by this article's presumption that white people just 'have it made'. bitch i didn't even dream of ivy league. local public college was the top of my scope of college ambition. stop worrying about the next person's lot and tend to your own.
in my experience, when i was rejected, i went on my own and proved that i can make it just fine without whatever organization/institution/group that rejected me - their loss! life is full of rejection, take it gracefully and show them up with your own accomplishments. the author of the article seems to hold that point of view so kudos to her. she gets it.
lastly i'll say no one cares what college you went to, and if they do - congratulations! you made your way into some elitist, 'exclusive' high society circle jerk. only thing that matters in this field (this is hacker news, right?) is skills, wherever you got em.
I don't see what this scrutinization of stereotypical trendy startup environments has to do with remote working. If a company has budget for it and wants to make its employees comfortable with open space, and the employees like it, it's their business. To suggest that "serious software engineering" isn't occurring because of how you suppose their workspace is setup is, frankly, offensive.
In software engineering, most of the work goes on inside the minds of the developers. Most of the remainder goes on in a keyboard and a screen. If you wanna get down to it, having more whiteboards and less fancy computer equipment is an indicator of better problem solving, not less.
I sit with three 19 inch monitors on my desk at work. At home, I use a 10 inch netbook most of the time. I have not seen a difference in productivity because when I am focused, I don't need screen real estate for more distractions. Everything just tunes out.
If you consider phd-level university computer science research as "serious software engineering" then I'd note that most research labs I came across in my days in academia were largely empty rooms with some tables and some work desks. Most of the students (phd students, mind you) worked on whiteboard and did coding and writing on whatever laptop they had. The workhorse machines w. big monitors were usually time-shared and dedicated to running heavy processing jobs.
As far as working from home goes, it seems you each agree that being comfortable with ones workspace and environment impacts productivity. That said, one is more likely to have a comfortable and productive work environment when it is up to him/her to decide what equipment to use and where, which a home office lends itself to more than an office, especially on a corporate cube-farm level. Sure, some individuals may not be as productive at a comfortable workspace in the home, but that is the individual. Working from home is not for everyone, but those who find they are more focused and productive in the home environment ought to have that choice.
in this day and age the notion that remote work hinders communication or scalability is absolutely absurd. Sure, it may hinder certain types of social interaction and communication, but in terms of collaborative engineering, it does not. Open source projects have managed tens, hundreds and even thousands of developers on single projects using rather primitive mailing lists, irc channels and source control. These days we have hangout and facetime, skype, hipchat... endless lists of intuitive textual, audible, and visual communication tools, project management tools, team management tools, code management tools...
Using the right tools and practices, remote working is FAR MORE scalable than in-office working, because you can leverage a mass of employees from all over the world without the need to build out office space, infrastructure and other overhead to facilitate physical colocation.
I'm lucky to enjoy living in Memphis, TN. Various reports put the median house price between $73,000 and $99,000, which seems about right based on my experience. Avg income reports range from about $39,000 to $46,000. Luckily, salaries for developers and engineers is roughly consistent with national averages, and sometimes higher due to unmet demand, which obviously sits well in this housing/income market.
There is also an increasing amount of state and local funding for startups and entrepreneurship, and with it a growing amount of programs to foster startups and small businesses and connect them with VCs. I've interviewed with several companies, small and large, in the valley and bay areas, but I've always found the absurd cost of living and crowded population to be a turn off. All that is to say, I wonder if the disproportionate costs and perceived lower-quality-of-life (to outsiders) will slowly decrease the centralization of tech startups in the valley. Perhaps it is a question of when, not if...
Sources:
http://www.homeinsight.com/home-value/tn/memphis.asphttp://money.cnn.com/magazines/moneymag/bplive/2011/snapshot...
I'm not an expert on government and law, but it is my understanding that due process is rooted in the recognition that circumstances are often more nuanced than laws can accommodate, and so evaluation of the circumstances are necessary for every case.
I'm not saying OSI actions should follow the same due process as criminal courts, but my point is no, saying the things he said at countless companies, corporations, environments, under some context or another, would not result in firing.