Ask HN: Too depressed to continue working. How do I get out?
19 comments
They have a business to run, but you have a life to live. If something catastrophic happened in the business and it were to shut down, would they continue to pay you at their own expense? Because that's what they're asking you to do—give their business your effort at great personal expense, in the form of your mental health. If you can stay on and muddle on as best you can to collect a paycheck, and you're up to it, great—as you said, you could use the money. But if your sanity requires taking a step back and assessing your life, then you should do that. You are going to have a long career—while your father's death will of course be one of the most impactful things you'll have to come to terms with, this job, whether you leave it or stay on, will be no more than a footnote to this chapter of your life.
My deepest condolences on your loss. We lost three members of my family in just over 18 months, and I know how difficult it can be to process.
My deepest condolences on your loss. We lost three members of my family in just over 18 months, and I know how difficult it can be to process.
I'm really sorry for your loss. I experienced something similar when I lost my son 5 years ago. It can be very dark the place you are right now, but believe me, it will get better. I went back to work after 2 weeks and it was extremely hard. I couldn't do anything and I would go the the restroom to cry, because people around me were feeling uncomfortable with my grief. I found an online support group that really helped me. I was so depressed that I can't even leave the house and meet other people, so the online group was a good starting point. After two weeks of terrible work, my employer agreed with me that I couldn't go on and I took a leave for health reasons. At my job I had disability insurance and profound depression qualifies as disability. You should go see a psychiatrist to have the depression diagnosis in your records and to try some medication. If you are feeling too bad, please, check yourself at a hospital. In my case it took me over a year in disability to recover from my son's loss.
Here are some links for depression support in NZ: www.depression.org.nz http://www.mentalhealth.org.nz/page/40-getting-help http://www.depressionsupportnetwork.org.nz/
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, seek help.
Here are some links for depression support in NZ: www.depression.org.nz http://www.mentalhealth.org.nz/page/40-getting-help http://www.depressionsupportnetwork.org.nz/
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, seek help.
Have you considered asking for unpaid leave? I'm not sure about New Zealand, but many companies in the US offer bereavement leave. The company might prefer to have you back, hopefully refreshed and in better spirits, rather than lose you altogether.
In any case, the most important thing is your mental health and happiness. It definitely sounds like you need more time off. You'll be able to find other work, and you have a very understandable explanation for your next employer.
Do you have friends you can reach out to? Somewhere to couch surf? I've found that in grief, having something to distract you makes a big difference in keeping you from wallowing in despair. That, and by the sound of it, you're still pretty depressed; please reach out to someone, you don't need to go it alone.
In any case, the most important thing is your mental health and happiness. It definitely sounds like you need more time off. You'll be able to find other work, and you have a very understandable explanation for your next employer.
Do you have friends you can reach out to? Somewhere to couch surf? I've found that in grief, having something to distract you makes a big difference in keeping you from wallowing in despair. That, and by the sound of it, you're still pretty depressed; please reach out to someone, you don't need to go it alone.
There is an option that will probably be as hard as continuing working but it'll help you in the long run: counseling/therapy. Grieving can be a very long process and you should use all the help you can get.
Apart from that, the only reason to stay with this company is if you want to avoid burning bridges.
Apart from that, the only reason to stay with this company is if you want to avoid burning bridges.
I decided I can’t do this job anymore so I gave my notice of resignation. Unless you really need to get back to the home country to fix anything, from what you've said, this is lose-lose for everyone.
You probably spent a lot on your career so far and you will someday not want that investment to fall too hard. Remember they also spent a lot of time with you probably already, and there's a training cost invested in you personally. It seems in everyone's interest to get you back in the zone. If you don't get the edge back, your employer gets nothing, so it's not like you're trying to force them or anything.
Establish that that is the situation, and given that situation, you need to be able to start from "hello world" at work. Get out of your expectations and it will be very easy to work yourself back in knowing that you're not under presser to be 100%. A very workable game plan is to start as if you are a new employee and work up one duty at a time. Get one side of the stress feedback loop broken and the other will dissipate on its own.
You'll be happier when you're starting to work, start picking up duties etc because a career is an investment that has a future. I think when you feel the future seeping in, you'll find it easier than you expected to start getting back into the groove.
You probably spent a lot on your career so far and you will someday not want that investment to fall too hard. Remember they also spent a lot of time with you probably already, and there's a training cost invested in you personally. It seems in everyone's interest to get you back in the zone. If you don't get the edge back, your employer gets nothing, so it's not like you're trying to force them or anything.
Establish that that is the situation, and given that situation, you need to be able to start from "hello world" at work. Get out of your expectations and it will be very easy to work yourself back in knowing that you're not under presser to be 100%. A very workable game plan is to start as if you are a new employee and work up one duty at a time. Get one side of the stress feedback loop broken and the other will dissipate on its own.
You'll be happier when you're starting to work, start picking up duties etc because a career is an investment that has a future. I think when you feel the future seeping in, you'll find it easier than you expected to start getting back into the groove.
Most truly efficient anti-depressants would take a couple of weeks to start working, so it is not an option. Your only chance is trying to take control of your mind and shift the focus of your thoughts. Try seeing a therapist, meditation courses or anything like that. Exercise also brings quick results (in a week or so). All of this is related to will-power and it could be trained, so just trying to keep the 'man up' attitude would help tremendously too.
My suggestion is try to work it out then leave when you are ready.
Possibly a temporary regimen of anti-depressants. I am sorry for you loss and have experienced something similar (I didn't take anti-depressants but realized later they may have helped when they were temporarily prescribed to someone else in a similar situation.)
Your father is gone but your life goes on. He would almost certainly wish you to make the best possible use of it.
Possibly a temporary regimen of anti-depressants. I am sorry for you loss and have experienced something similar (I didn't take anti-depressants but realized later they may have helped when they were temporarily prescribed to someone else in a similar situation.)
Your father is gone but your life goes on. He would almost certainly wish you to make the best possible use of it.
I'm very sorry to hear of your loss, and wish you all the best in the coming period! While I don't have any light work to share at this time, don't hesitate to hit me up if down the road you feel ready to do some 'small' things. I might have something then.
One question concerning your bosses. How clear have you expressed to them the extent of your suffering? Do they know you cry, and have trouble doing basic tasks?
The reason I'm asking is that I find 'we' are so used to not expressing the true nature of our feelings, especially in a work context (but even with friends), and perhaps especially as men (which I'm assuming you are, erroneously perhaps), that we sometimes aren't even aware that we might not have properly communicated this. I've made that mistake a few times.
Furthermore, assuming you are legally allowed to just up and leave and assuming it won't have negative consequences for you personally, this might be a good time to be selfish about it. They'll figure it out without you! You need to think of you right now!
I don't mean to be presumptuous; just something to consider.
One question concerning your bosses. How clear have you expressed to them the extent of your suffering? Do they know you cry, and have trouble doing basic tasks?
The reason I'm asking is that I find 'we' are so used to not expressing the true nature of our feelings, especially in a work context (but even with friends), and perhaps especially as men (which I'm assuming you are, erroneously perhaps), that we sometimes aren't even aware that we might not have properly communicated this. I've made that mistake a few times.
Furthermore, assuming you are legally allowed to just up and leave and assuming it won't have negative consequences for you personally, this might be a good time to be selfish about it. They'll figure it out without you! You need to think of you right now!
I don't mean to be presumptuous; just something to consider.
Can you muster the strength for a brief run? Changing your physiology, changes your psychology. Exercise has been shown to alleviate depression, force yourself daily. If your father saw you in this shape, what might he counsel? Assuming he was a student of the Old School, he might say "now get your head in the game and tough it out!" Soldier on!
I can't comment on specifics for NZ (but one month? I thought normal was two weeks notice). But, if the normal notice is one month, and they are asking for more, then explain it's not possible. Moreover, explain that while you are there, you won't be able to provide your best work, and moreover, it might even be detrimental to their business if you are working poorly. Especially if you are the only developer, you could be creating a situation that takes a new dev longer to fix, than for them to do the correct thing from scratch.
Read your contract carefully. Also read the laws carefully. You might well have the right to quit when you want. And in NZ I would assume that you would have a strong worker's advocate if the business wants to be shit and not pay you for work done.
Also, as others have said, be sure to use any leave you have coming.
Read your contract carefully. Also read the laws carefully. You might well have the right to quit when you want. And in NZ I would assume that you would have a strong worker's advocate if the business wants to be shit and not pay you for work done.
Also, as others have said, be sure to use any leave you have coming.
First -- you are by no means alone. It may not make you feel any better but you are in good company. Most people suffer depression at some point in their life, some worse than others. Lincoln, Churchill -- this famous VC, Brad Feld: http://www.feld.com/wp/archives/2013/12/dont-fight-depressio...
If your grief is preventing you from functioning, I agree with people below who suggest therapy and medication. Why not give that a try? There's no shame -- it shows courage, and will help you grieve. Meditation and exercise are great eveners too. And being unemployed and depressed could make things even worse.
Good luck and warm wishes. It will get better. You will find peace and you will recover.
If your grief is preventing you from functioning, I agree with people below who suggest therapy and medication. Why not give that a try? There's no shame -- it shows courage, and will help you grieve. Meditation and exercise are great eveners too. And being unemployed and depressed could make things even worse.
Good luck and warm wishes. It will get better. You will find peace and you will recover.
Just leave. Wait till you get your next paycheck and explain you can't do any productive work and finish.
I'm going to skip on the depression stuff apart from: go see a doctor (gp- general practitioner) and tell them you are depressed. Explain why. They will help you. They will also refer you to a free or affordable place to go get counciling. If they dont help, find another.
Regarding work: it is very hard to fire someone in nz. It will likely not happen. You need to talk to your boss be honest and open they will probably give you paid leave or work out manageable part time hours for you to keep things ticking over but not have too much pressure.
The prospects are extremely good in nz right now so I'm not sure where you get that idea. I can refer you to a good recruiter if you want.
Regarding work: it is very hard to fire someone in nz. It will likely not happen. You need to talk to your boss be honest and open they will probably give you paid leave or work out manageable part time hours for you to keep things ticking over but not have too much pressure.
The prospects are extremely good in nz right now so I'm not sure where you get that idea. I can refer you to a good recruiter if you want.
I second those who said "get help".
But I would also say that YOU NEED TO FORGIVE YOURSELF.
You didn't tell us all the circumstances, just that you didn't make it in time to see him off. I can understand feeling badly about that. I can understand kicking yourself for it. But guilt?
You made a mistake. It worked out badly. It hurts. But forgive yourself, both for your own sake and for your father's. (I didn't know your father, but I suspect that he would not want you driving yourself into the inability to function over this. It seems more likely that he would say, "I forgive you, son. Get back up. Keep going.")
But I would also say that YOU NEED TO FORGIVE YOURSELF.
You didn't tell us all the circumstances, just that you didn't make it in time to see him off. I can understand feeling badly about that. I can understand kicking yourself for it. But guilt?
You made a mistake. It worked out badly. It hurts. But forgive yourself, both for your own sake and for your father's. (I didn't know your father, but I suspect that he would not want you driving yourself into the inability to function over this. It seems more likely that he would say, "I forgive you, son. Get back up. Keep going.")
First of all, I am so terribly sorry for your loss. I cannot begin to understand the pain you are going through.
I think you need to consider many things before leaving, screwing up deliberately to get fired might shut the doors at this company should you find yourself in better spirits down the road and wanting to return.
I think your father would want what's best for you. Think about that, think about the times you had, it's terrible that you lost your father, but think of all the happy times you had with him and hold on to those memories to pull you through.
I sincerely hope you feel better soon, and again, so sorry for your loss.
I think you need to consider many things before leaving, screwing up deliberately to get fired might shut the doors at this company should you find yourself in better spirits down the road and wanting to return.
I think your father would want what's best for you. Think about that, think about the times you had, it's terrible that you lost your father, but think of all the happy times you had with him and hold on to those memories to pull you through.
I sincerely hope you feel better soon, and again, so sorry for your loss.
You need to talk things out with a professional grief counselor.
p.s. -- and when you feel better, if you're interested in (paying) freelance work and have the right skills, send me an email at stephen dot impassebreaker dot com. I can't guarantee you that it will be a ton of work or a ton of money. I can guarantee you that depression will not be a strike against you, if you can do the work. But get help first and don't screw up deliberately and get yourself fired.
suppose you were not physically well enough to work, and wanted to quit. then it would be ridiculous to "force" you to work.
this is the same.
> "normally, one must stay on for a month after giving notice"
it is not a normal circumstance.
do you have sick leave? can you exhaust that first?
this is the same.
> "normally, one must stay on for a month after giving notice"
it is not a normal circumstance.
do you have sick leave? can you exhaust that first?
Hey, you never replied. How's it going? Can you post a throwaway GMail?
I’m on my first of six weeks and I honestly don’t know how I can stay on here. I’m the only developer and I handle support as well as maintenance. I can’t find the energy to care about my work. I also can’t program worth a damn. I’m making silly mistakes and then putting out my own fires in this crazy loop of anxiety and stress.
I’ve been looking for other work, small website development jobs or helpdesk support, something that I can handle while I continue to grieve. The prospects aren’t good for a recent graduate and immigrant in New Zealand but I’ve got 3 months to try before I have to leave. But until then, how do I even continue at this job? If I could do six weeks, I wouldn’t even be considering quitting. I thought I could handle it before but the depression is only getting worse.
What are my options? Screw up and deliberately get fired?