Why Facebook sucks(scripting.com)
scripting.com
Why Facebook sucks
http://www.scripting.com/stories/2007/10/13/whyFacebookSucks.html
27 comments
The real point is that it doesn't give you control over your data while profiting off of it.
Others have said this in different ways before but it bears repeating.
Others have said this in different ways before but it bears repeating.
Maybe, but the thing is...Facebook is pretty awesome.
I know that probably sounds a little juvenile, but that's the attitude that most of its users have. They could care less about having control of their data. The vast majority have no clue that Facebook could give them control of their data, and even if it happened they wouldn't know what to do with it.
"Hey neat, I downloaded my Facebook. I wonder if I'm supposed to play XML files in iTunes or Powerpoint..."
The only thing that millions of people would (not could) potentially do with their Facebook data is: move away from Facebook, given a better alternative. I haven't yet seen a solid argument for why Facebook should open up that data. Maybe there are decent ethical/moral/rhetorical reasons, but none which make business sense for Facebook and the majority of their customers...
I know that probably sounds a little juvenile, but that's the attitude that most of its users have. They could care less about having control of their data. The vast majority have no clue that Facebook could give them control of their data, and even if it happened they wouldn't know what to do with it.
"Hey neat, I downloaded my Facebook. I wonder if I'm supposed to play XML files in iTunes or Powerpoint..."
The only thing that millions of people would (not could) potentially do with their Facebook data is: move away from Facebook, given a better alternative. I haven't yet seen a solid argument for why Facebook should open up that data. Maybe there are decent ethical/moral/rhetorical reasons, but none which make business sense for Facebook and the majority of their customers...
Customers will care about controlling their data as soon as someone offers a useful product that requires it. Many are already reluctant to get involved with Facebook because of this.
http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000052.html
As it is, MySpace users who want to switch to Facebook do it anyway, leaving behind a GhostSpace where they log into to check messages maybe once every 2-3 months. People are going to get sick of that crap, and will switch to a service that promises they'll never have to worry about it again.
http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000052.html
As it is, MySpace users who want to switch to Facebook do it anyway, leaving behind a GhostSpace where they log into to check messages maybe once every 2-3 months. People are going to get sick of that crap, and will switch to a service that promises they'll never have to worry about it again.
If it was possible to export that data there would be apps to help people to process it further. No need to stumble around in XML piles. Your "makes no business sense" argument is not even Web 1.0 ;-) It's the ages old argument that was brought forward wrt Office file formats, pre TCP/IP network protocols and an endless list of other lock-in strategies. Even Microsoft has shed that retro attitude to some degree exactly because it does not make business sense in the long run. You need third parties to build on your stuff and that means you must set the data free.
Your post and the one above by Goladus have helped me change my attitude towards this. Thanks for your replies.
That "pre-Web 1.0" stab wound will certainly take time to heal, though ;)
That "pre-Web 1.0" stab wound will certainly take time to heal, though ;)
But people only care when 3rd-party tools exist that they can't use. Right now, the ivory tower is okay, because the rest of the landscape is flat and barren.
I think people do care a lot about moving data between applications. There is nothing that comes up more often when end users need help. Today I was asked to move emails out of Mac Mail. Last month it was watch lists from a trading site to an Access database. Data silos are a huge problem and a productivity killer.
I concur, and ignorance is bliss :)
I'm hoping Facebook will acquire the same stigma that AOL, an older data roach motel/walled garden, did.
I think a facebook-aim comparison is far better than a facebook-aol one
aol instant messenger is still BY FAR the most popular im network in America
Geeks and hackers can sit here and say the world would be better if everyone used Jabber or some other open protocol, but it won't catch on because...
1) people like aim 2) their friends are on aim
aol instant messenger is still BY FAR the most popular im network in America
Geeks and hackers can sit here and say the world would be better if everyone used Jabber or some other open protocol, but it won't catch on because...
1) people like aim 2) their friends are on aim
I'm convinced that people who slate facebook haven't really used it. It is currently my most effective means of communicating with friends and family. And I don't think I've ever come across such a polished application before, web-based or otherwise.
He's not arguing that facebook isn't an effective means of communication or a good web-app.
His (valid) point is that users put all their information into facebook without being able to take it back out when they want. There's an imbalance there and it does suck.
His (valid) point is that users put all their information into facebook without being able to take it back out when they want. There's an imbalance there and it does suck.
Well the article is entitled 'Why Facebook Sucks'. I personally don't agree that the point is valid. What you have in Facebook is a list of contacts for other Facebook users. It wouldn't be that useful outside of Facebook.
The author admits the title is not precise:
PS: When I write about it, I do it crudely, saying they suck or don't. When Doc Searls writes about it he calls it Vendor Relationship Management. Doc writes so elegantly because he is a research fellow at Harvard University.
PS: When I write about it, I do it crudely, saying they suck or don't. When Doc Searls writes about it he calls it Vendor Relationship Management. Doc writes so elegantly because he is a research fellow at Harvard University.
No sane company would open itself completely after only few years of existence.
First, obviously it is a social networking fest out there and facebook would be scared--even as it leads--of potential competitors. That is a valid reason to not open up.
Secondly, opening up at any level has lots of implications, especially concerning privacy. I would say we should be pretty happy with the direction facebook is going in. Few years into existence and it has built a promising application platform.
To all the folks saying that facebook will die the AOL way: they can, but not with the current team. If a day comes when facebook's existence is threatend because they are not opening up enough, guess what? They'll open up some more.
First, obviously it is a social networking fest out there and facebook would be scared--even as it leads--of potential competitors. That is a valid reason to not open up.
Secondly, opening up at any level has lots of implications, especially concerning privacy. I would say we should be pretty happy with the direction facebook is going in. Few years into existence and it has built a promising application platform.
To all the folks saying that facebook will die the AOL way: they can, but not with the current team. If a day comes when facebook's existence is threatend because they are not opening up enough, guess what? They'll open up some more.
Agreed. They're better stewards of my social data than I could ever be.
What about the API? It wouldn't be at all hard to make a "Facebook-exporter" application using that. The question is: why would I bother doing that? Facebook is crap as an address book, it's the other bits that are useful...
Whatever other reasons there are to think Facebook sucks I don't think this is one.
Whatever other reasons there are to think Facebook sucks I don't think this is one.
It's also worth noting that you can't get e-mail or any other contact info from the API.
What's interesting about this argument, is that facebook used to have a feature to export all your friends to vCards. I asked their VP of Product Marketing recently why they got rid of the feature, and he claimed it was to protect users from spam. "Facebook is all about edge cases, and we haven't had the time to focus on the problems that would cause", or something to that effect.
What's interesting about this argument, is that facebook used to have a feature to export all your friends to vCards. I asked their VP of Product Marketing recently why they got rid of the feature, and he claimed it was to protect users from spam. "Facebook is all about edge cases, and we haven't had the time to focus on the problems that would cause", or something to that effect.
I think spam is the biggest reason, after the inherent difficult of developing client-side apps, that online social networks growing towards email were more successful than email growing towards social networks.
Most college folks would celebrate if all the Winers of the world abandoned facebook.
Not clear. What do you mean?
99.9% of facebook users don't care about how "open" facebook is--until it remains a very useful social tool.
So because a majority doesn't care, we're not allowed to critically assess Facebook's shortcomings or voice our opinions over its policies?
Winer is simply stating his opinion and pointing out the lack of openness when it comes to Facebook's data.
Winer is simply stating his opinion and pointing out the lack of openness when it comes to Facebook's data.
If Winer was stating his opinion, so was I:)
Perhaps I should have been more clear: I think facebook is pretty open, I don't think there is an immediate need for facebook to make it easy for users to move to other networks.
Perhaps I should have been more clear: I think facebook is pretty open, I don't think there is an immediate need for facebook to make it easy for users to move to other networks.
"Reddit sucks -- you can't use it to reserve seats at your local movie theater! You know what else you can't do? Thwart velociraptors. When is someone going to release a social news site which allows me, the user, to outwit a raptor? Google is, as usual, our only hope."
I dunno, maybe I wouldn't be so flippant if I had invented RSS and was, apparently, in constant contact with Robert Scoble ;)