Read your Hacker News in Tile Style(apps.microsoft.com)
apps.microsoft.com
Read your Hacker News in Tile Style
http://apps.microsoft.com/windows/en-us/app/hackernews-reader/ae66a0ea-c66d-42cc-a58b-44799e2eb2fa
11 comments
As a user, scanning a 2D array of tiles feels like work. I think this might be part of the reason: if I don't remember how a particular app or page is laid out, I have to scan both ways and decide which way makes more sense.
Maybe a single convention could emerge per mobile platform, but across the entire web, I doubt it, and honestly, my biggest problem with 2D grids is that scanning every item systematically feel very unnatural, and I doubt I will ever break that habit. Decades of reading has led me to see me to see Roman text as coherent, directed strings, and lists also naturally elicit in-order scanning behavior for me, but 2D grids of squares or rectangles are used for things that require different scanning behavior. When I look at maps, board games, and color or fabric samples, for example, I tend to hop around looking for patterns among groups of tiles, combined with occasional breadth-first scanning outward from points. My first reaction to a 2D grid is never to systematically scan all individual items but to start jumping around impressionistically, and then to switch to a systematic scan if the impressionistic method fails. Naturally, switching provokes irritation, both at myself and at the situation.
I wonder if the experience is different for people who grew up reading Chinese.
Maybe a single convention could emerge per mobile platform, but across the entire web, I doubt it, and honestly, my biggest problem with 2D grids is that scanning every item systematically feel very unnatural, and I doubt I will ever break that habit. Decades of reading has led me to see me to see Roman text as coherent, directed strings, and lists also naturally elicit in-order scanning behavior for me, but 2D grids of squares or rectangles are used for things that require different scanning behavior. When I look at maps, board games, and color or fabric samples, for example, I tend to hop around looking for patterns among groups of tiles, combined with occasional breadth-first scanning outward from points. My first reaction to a 2D grid is never to systematically scan all individual items but to start jumping around impressionistically, and then to switch to a systematic scan if the impressionistic method fails. Naturally, switching provokes irritation, both at myself and at the situation.
I wonder if the experience is different for people who grew up reading Chinese.
This is, in my opinion, the single largest problem with tile matrices that have unrestricted length and width. Its very hard to tailor the reading experience to be anything better than mediocre -- and at times on short, wide screens, its downright awful. Windows 8 makes a mess of things by scrolling sideways in landscape mode, then up and down in portrait mode. Readability is sacrificed at the alter of adaptable design. The tiles lead the eyes no where -- because content can really go in any direction (up down left right? why not down through 3D or even up or spinning maybe too? They are all done in Windows 8)
The other thing tiles do poorly is constrain the variances on line lengths by boxing them in. When you scan headlines, you naturally grip the page using the various headline lengths. Boxing them in and cutting them off makes every headline appear the same length and kills their distinguishability (and implied reading direction).
Ultimately, I believe its most comfortable read across the most narrow dimension of a screen -- depending on orientation -- then scroll the opposite of the reading direction.
That being said, users will also tend towards their native reading direction (Japanese users will read down, English, readers across from left to right, Arabic from the right to left)
Discloser: Im a UX and UI designer who has worked on Windows 8, iOS, Android, and about 10 other operation systems. I have also designed mixed language or language-free interfaces to varying success.
The other thing tiles do poorly is constrain the variances on line lengths by boxing them in. When you scan headlines, you naturally grip the page using the various headline lengths. Boxing them in and cutting them off makes every headline appear the same length and kills their distinguishability (and implied reading direction).
Ultimately, I believe its most comfortable read across the most narrow dimension of a screen -- depending on orientation -- then scroll the opposite of the reading direction.
That being said, users will also tend towards their native reading direction (Japanese users will read down, English, readers across from left to right, Arabic from the right to left)
Discloser: Im a UX and UI designer who has worked on Windows 8, iOS, Android, and about 10 other operation systems. I have also designed mixed language or language-free interfaces to varying success.
Given the way most things in Windows 8 scroll sideways rather than vertically (at least in the tile-based UI things like the store, or Netflix), having things ordered in columns rather than rows will be a more intuitive ordering of stories than orienting them in rows.
On a side note, I was dismayed to notice that the "App website" link led to Quixby's "coming soon" screen, which is probably not terribly helpful for users who might want to know more. However, this is fairly well mitigated by the excellent selection of screenshots showing different use cases. The only question I couldn't answer from reading the in-store details was whether it would allow me to log in and up-vote stories and comments, since I consider that an integral part of my usage of HN.
On a side note, I was dismayed to notice that the "App website" link led to Quixby's "coming soon" screen, which is probably not terribly helpful for users who might want to know more. However, this is fairly well mitigated by the excellent selection of screenshots showing different use cases. The only question I couldn't answer from reading the in-store details was whether it would allow me to log in and up-vote stories and comments, since I consider that an integral part of my usage of HN.
However you can see that this app, in fairly typical Metro style, scrolls across to the right. I can't think of any nice ordering horizontally that allows for that without constraining you to individual screens, like
[1 2 5 6 ] [3 4 7 8]
[1 2 5 6 ] [3 4 7 8]
Is this possible to change to the scrolling direction to up and down only? It would then feel more like reading a newspaper and also work well with HN's scoring system.
Tile style seems to really de-emphasize the titles of the articles in favor of their score.
Emphasizing the score, especially with the ranking algorithm being so time based is fairly confusing. It seems like the number should be in order, but they of course aren't.
A fix may be as simple as changing the two greys, having the darker grey behind the article title, and the lighter one behind the number. Also, increasing the contrast in the title text would be great.
Emphasizing the score, especially with the ranking algorithm being so time based is fairly confusing. It seems like the number should be in order, but they of course aren't.
A fix may be as simple as changing the two greys, having the darker grey behind the article title, and the lighter one behind the number. Also, increasing the contrast in the title text would be great.
> "A fix may be as simple as changing the two greys"
You're drawn to 1. the contrast between the colors and 2. the visually-emphasized smaller box pulled 'on top' of the larger box of text.
Wwapping the greys would do nothing for the net contrast. If anything it'd exacerbate the effect by making the block of text darker and less noticeable. Lessening the difference between the two greys would cause them to blend more and take out some of the 'pop'.
But I think 2. is the bigger problem. You'd want to put the 'score' inside the larger box to de-emphasize that element.
You're drawn to 1. the contrast between the colors and 2. the visually-emphasized smaller box pulled 'on top' of the larger box of text.
Wwapping the greys would do nothing for the net contrast. If anything it'd exacerbate the effect by making the block of text darker and less noticeable. Lessening the difference between the two greys would cause them to blend more and take out some of the 'pop'.
But I think 2. is the bigger problem. You'd want to put the 'score' inside the larger box to de-emphasize that element.
Good suggestions, will experiment a bit and see what we can do to improve it!
Why does the 'App Website' link take me to a prelaunch/landing page for something completely different?
Our company is 'Quixby', so the app website link is to that site as it's our main project currently. We don't have any dedicated app website is all, or we would link to that.
I feel like the Tile Layout isn't the most useful thing for a site like Hacker News- perhaps if we had more images, I'd see it, but the Tile Layout turns our column of text into a wall of text.
Does anybody know if it handles opening links or comments?
Does anybody know if it handles opening links or comments?
i'd love to app a Chrome app like this one.
That's not a bad idea, will definitely look into that soon!
US $ 1.49 to access Hacker News content through an app?!
This should be open source and free.
This should be open source and free.
Why exactly should it be free and open source? Because last time I checked hacker news isn't specifically free or open source, it's news for hackers, and it's parent company (ycombinator) tailors itself to startups and investors. Both of which want to make money, so I'm not really getting how you came to your conclusion. I for one don't mind paying $1.49 for an app, I just spent 5 dollars on coffee...
I can't give a real argument. It would be more out of respect to the content which originates from other people and quite often deals in topic which are open/free. But 1.49 is not much and if it helps the dev...
I agree somewhat with you, though. If the app were free, I'd install it in a heartbeat. I'd wish there were a way to select it now for installation on my home machine before I get home, if that were possible.
With a price on it, I suddenly have to go through the hassle of attaching a payment method to my Windows Store account (something which I've been EXTREMELY hesitant to do). It's enough of a barrier to entry that I am likely to fob it off as something to do Later (as I can read HN quite well in my browser), rather than go through that added hurdle.
If I already had payment info entered for my Store account, that barrier to me buying it would be much lower: rather than having to consider both the time and money investment, I'd only have to say "Eh, it's a buck fifty", and would be much more likely to buy it. As it is, my interest has waned from "I must install this yesterday" to "I'll have to think about it".
With a price on it, I suddenly have to go through the hassle of attaching a payment method to my Windows Store account (something which I've been EXTREMELY hesitant to do). It's enough of a barrier to entry that I am likely to fob it off as something to do Later (as I can read HN quite well in my browser), rather than go through that added hurdle.
If I already had payment info entered for my Store account, that barrier to me buying it would be much lower: rather than having to consider both the time and money investment, I'd only have to say "Eh, it's a buck fifty", and would be much more likely to buy it. As it is, my interest has waned from "I must install this yesterday" to "I'll have to think about it".
cool; please post here when you're done.
browser is fine, thanks; yeah, cool, take other people's content and monetize...
Yeah cool, can you work for me for FREE ?
But nice troll.
But nice troll.
Why should Quixby be allowed to scalp the content for FREE?
You are not paying for the content, you are paying for an alternate way to consume the content.
Feed readers, Apple, Google and every other search engine. etc?
Nice try friday troll !
Don't know why you wrote this (two times). Probably too oldfashioned I am, but at least you seem to be ok (http://portfotolio.net/t0t0_). Bonne soirée!
I don't mind that the dude is charging $1.49 for his efforts, but the code should be open sourced!
Would you do something with it, if it was open source? I can't understand people begging to have everything open sourced, but unwilling to dedicate time to write a single line of code (or patches, or testing, or documentation).
Yes, it's okay for developers to invest their own time to develop something, and try to recover their costs by selling it. And it's also ok if they decide to keep it closed source, because probably no one would bother to help. Just vote with your money.
(posted using news:yc on iOS, that I paid $2.99. And it's open source btw).
Yes, it's okay for developers to invest their own time to develop something, and try to recover their costs by selling it. And it's also ok if they decide to keep it closed source, because probably no one would bother to help. Just vote with your money.
(posted using news:yc on iOS, that I paid $2.99. And it's open source btw).
I'd read it, and learn how Windows 8 app development works.
I'd potentially notice security issues and inform the author, if there are any.
I might notice performance issues and point those out.
I'd potentially notice security issues and inform the author, if there are any.
I might notice performance issues and point those out.
> Yes, it's okay for developers to invest their own time to develop something, and try to recover their costs by selling it. And it's also ok if they decide to keep it closed source, because probably no one would bother to help. Just vote with your money.
If really nobody is interested in helping develop for it, I doubt many people would be willing to go out of their way to compile it from source to avoid paying for it too.
As you yourself demonstrate, making money off of your development and making that same project open source aren't mutually exclusive - so why not make it open source?
If really nobody is interested in helping develop for it, I doubt many people would be willing to go out of their way to compile it from source to avoid paying for it too.
As you yourself demonstrate, making money off of your development and making that same project open source aren't mutually exclusive - so why not make it open source?
Why?
Because yitchelle wants it free. We bait so many flamewars around here on questions we already know the answer to.
I'm asking why should it be open source, not why does yitchelle want it open source. I'm was actually asking genuinely, perhaps there was a reason yitchelle felt there was a moral reason it should be open source.
Perhaps I misinterpreted yitchelle's comment, I read should in the absolute sense of 'it's morally correct', not in the jovial 'i'd like to chcek out the source!'. But i certainly wasn't baiting any flamewar.
Perhaps I misinterpreted yitchelle's comment, I read should in the absolute sense of 'it's morally correct', not in the jovial 'i'd like to chcek out the source!'. But i certainly wasn't baiting any flamewar.
Why not?
Looks great from the screenshot, I'll have to try this out later. The description doesn't state whether you can comment, post or vote from the app - I take it that's not possible?
Currently you cannot comment, post or vote from the app. It's possible, albeit more complicated. The problem is one of security, so we are taking a bit more time to ensure we do the commenting, posting and voting correctly.
This is something we will have in soon though!
This is something we will have in soon though!
Here's a suggestion: make the app free for anonymous use. When you get the login, voting, etc. working correctly have an in-app purchase to enable the logged-in features. This way you can build a larger initial base of users and later on upsell them to functionality worth paying for.
I second biot's idea. I'll buy it right now though since I want to see it go further and you need money for that. Might I suggest for the time being adding in a right click and "open in browser" that leads to the comment page for the article? That ways it's at least a quick one step to get where you need to be in order to comment and upvote.
Great idea! We are rolling out an update today, but will be sure to wrap in all of these suggestions in a follow-up update soon!
Great, good luck with it!
I hope it is not buggy, but nice one!
Dev Here: It should be bug free! Always looking for ways to improve though. Any feedback is greatly appreciated.
I really like the app so far! Great work! I did find a couple bugs though:
1) You probably shouldn't use the same bar to split the article and comments that Windows uses to resize pinned applications. This makes it look resizable when it's not.
2) Sometimes my mouse's scroll wheel stops scrolling. I think this has something to do with the ad reloading. I don't know if you have any control over that, but I found it annoying. I think the ad is stealing focus.
3) The ad on the main page stays on top of the Settings flyout (Win+I -> Settings)
4) Right-clicking on the article side (the web control) causes the appbar to fly in and then immediately disappear. The article also flickers. This does not repro when right-clicking on the comment side.
Most of these are ad related, so maybe that's my cue to buy it... Otherwise, great app! I like it.
1) You probably shouldn't use the same bar to split the article and comments that Windows uses to resize pinned applications. This makes it look resizable when it's not.
2) Sometimes my mouse's scroll wheel stops scrolling. I think this has something to do with the ad reloading. I don't know if you have any control over that, but I found it annoying. I think the ad is stealing focus.
3) The ad on the main page stays on top of the Settings flyout (Win+I -> Settings)
4) Right-clicking on the article side (the web control) causes the appbar to fly in and then immediately disappear. The article also flickers. This does not repro when right-clicking on the comment side.
Most of these are ad related, so maybe that's my cue to buy it... Otherwise, great app! I like it.
Thanks for the feedback LaserChicken!
We have a few of these resolved in an update we are wrapping up today. However, #1 is a good catch, will be sure to fix that.
#2 is resolved in the next update, and #3 we will look into.
While I have not personally experienced #4, I will test this right now following your notes and add it to the list!
Really appreciate the detailed reports of the bugs.
We have a few of these resolved in an update we are wrapping up today. However, #1 is a good catch, will be sure to fix that.
#2 is resolved in the next update, and #3 we will look into.
While I have not personally experienced #4, I will test this right now following your notes and add it to the list!
Really appreciate the detailed reports of the bugs.
Looks nice. Any plans for other platforms?
Definitely, iOS and Android are next on the chopping block. As well as a variation for WP8.
Will it work with Windows 9?
Well we tested it on Windows ME, so Windows 9 should be a cakewalk.
I thought paid advertisements on this site didn't allow a comment section?
Besides, I thought the whole point of the crappy site design was so that it would scare of people who either need eye can't or can't configure a browser to make it look different.
Besides, I thought the whole point of the crappy site design was so that it would scare of people who either need eye can't or can't configure a browser to make it look different.
Paid advertisement? I don't believe this falls into that category.
Seems like a fan of this Windows 8 app posted this.
Seems like a fan of this Windows 8 app posted this.
Not specifically http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html but do agree - don't think it needs a upvote.
This is someone who likes hackernews who made an app, to bring it on windows 8 with a nice UX and he is asking for $1.49 which is not much at all...
What's wrong with that ?
Come on, give the guy a break and enjoy his good work.
EDIT: I don't know why I was thinking about windows mobile, my bad.
What's wrong with that ?
Come on, give the guy a break and enjoy his good work.
EDIT: I don't know why I was thinking about windows mobile, my bad.
I agree with your point, but it's for windows 8 desktop/RT, not windows phone.
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Is more natural to read than:
I would think that since we read from left to right and then down, that the standard matrix ordering row, then column, might be more preferable.
Yet, horizontal scroll plays a larger role in metro, so this might not be a bad idea. I'd love to hear from someone who knows anything about UX in regards to this sort of thing.