Troll thread
Post any of those controversial topics you would really like to talk about, but don't because we don't like trolls here.
6 comments
I don't know if this thread is a good idea, but the timing is certainly good for me. Yesterday, I got modded down to -7 for suggesting that a company like 37signals isn't a startup.
A startup is a business whose primary aim is growth. If you focus on revenue, you do so at the expense of growth, because people prefer free stuff over non-free stuff.
Could someone explain to me why I'm wrong? (I am not saying this rhetorically, by the way. If we assume that this community is as smart as everyone says it is, then I must be wrong.)
A startup is a business whose primary aim is growth. If you focus on revenue, you do so at the expense of growth, because people prefer free stuff over non-free stuff.
Could someone explain to me why I'm wrong? (I am not saying this rhetorically, by the way. If we assume that this community is as smart as everyone says it is, then I must be wrong.)
Maybe it rubbed people the wrong way right after DHH's talk at Startup School. Six weeks ago, I got 3000 page views (mostly from Hacker News) and 24 karma for an article where I made the exact same assertion (37s isn't a startup), and not one person complained about the characterization:
"Facebook is a startup - a huge and wildly successful one, but until they find their killer revenue model, they’re living off of investment money. 37signals is not a startup - they were profitable from web design consulting while they developed Basecamp, Rails, etc, and now their products fund their business without outside investment. Fog Creek was a startup (living off of Joel’s MSFT cash) until FogBugz took off, and now revenue from that product runs their business. Google is a business, but until they perfected AdWords and Adsense (2002? 2003?), they were like Facebook is now, a really big successful startup. YouTube went from startup to acquisition and never was a business."
http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=130757
http://www.pchristensen.com/blog/articles/hacker-vs-engineer...
"Facebook is a startup - a huge and wildly successful one, but until they find their killer revenue model, they’re living off of investment money. 37signals is not a startup - they were profitable from web design consulting while they developed Basecamp, Rails, etc, and now their products fund their business without outside investment. Fog Creek was a startup (living off of Joel’s MSFT cash) until FogBugz took off, and now revenue from that product runs their business. Google is a business, but until they perfected AdWords and Adsense (2002? 2003?), they were like Facebook is now, a really big successful startup. YouTube went from startup to acquisition and never was a business."
http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=130757
http://www.pchristensen.com/blog/articles/hacker-vs-engineer...
"If you focus on revenue, you do so at the expense of growth"
Only to a certain extent - there are many companies that both grow and focus on revenue. And personally I think that this is a much better strategy for two reasons:
1) If you don't get funding or get acquired you still have a business. And since probably less than 1% of startups make this cut it seems like a good bet.
2) If you create revenue from day one your customers are your main priority. If you are always looking for more funding to grow your focus shifts to acquiring capital, and your goals shift accordingly. It is more important to have a whole bunch of freeloaders than to have returning paying customers.
Only to a certain extent - there are many companies that both grow and focus on revenue. And personally I think that this is a much better strategy for two reasons:
1) If you don't get funding or get acquired you still have a business. And since probably less than 1% of startups make this cut it seems like a good bet.
2) If you create revenue from day one your customers are your main priority. If you are always looking for more funding to grow your focus shifts to acquiring capital, and your goals shift accordingly. It is more important to have a whole bunch of freeloaders than to have returning paying customers.
What you did wrong? You broke our chain of groupthink! How dare you!!1one!
[insert jealousy for company with no business model]
[troll complete]
[insert jealousy for company with no business model]
[troll complete]
<Donut[AFK]> HEY EURAKARTE
<Donut[AFK]> INSULT
<Eurakarte> RETORT
<Donut[AFK]> COUNTER-RETORT
<Eurakarte> QUESTIONING OF SEXUAL PREFERENCE
<Donut[AFK]> SUGGESTION TO SHUT THE FUCK UP
<Eurakarte> NOTATION THAT YOU CREATE A VACUUM
<Donut[AFK]> RIPOSTE
<Donut[AFK]> ADDON RIPOSTE
<Eurakarte> COUNTER-RIPOSTE
<Donut[AFK]> COUNTER-COUNTER RIPOSTE
<Eurakarte> NONSENSICAL STATEMENT INVOLVING PLANKTON
<Miles_Prower> RESPONSE TO RANDOM STATEMENT AND THREAT TO BAN OPPOSING SIDES
<Eurakarte> WORDS OF PRAISE FOR FISHFOOD
<Miles_Prower> ACKNOWLEDGEMENT AND ACCEPTENCE OF TERMSControversial?
Most people here trying to create startups are wasting their time. They want to have a startup so as to become financially free, but it is much quicker and more dependable to save up money, stick it in an investment account and then live overseas.
Most people here trying to create startups are wasting their time. They want to have a startup so as to become financially free, but it is much quicker and more dependable to save up money, stick it in an investment account and then live overseas.
http://www.soapboxxer.com/ is better for this sort of thing. Otherwise I'm kinda tired of flamewars/trolls and the like.
I'm not actually anticipating flames and trolls, just people posting things they think would usually get flamed or considered a troll. Just curious what'll pop up.
It'll all be contained here too so as not to bug the other submissions, and you'll only come here if you expect something controversial.
It'll all be contained here too so as not to bug the other submissions, and you'll only come here if you expect something controversial.
I think it's a great idea.
Sounds like fun...
Sounds like fun...
but soapboxxer is perfect for that ;). It's all about controversial stuff.
But it isn't on HN, and I bet lots of people don't know about it. So, posting there effectively silences controversy.
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