Regulators urge safety recall of Peloton treadmill after child dies(washingtonpost.com)
washingtonpost.com
Regulators urge safety recall of Peloton treadmill after child dies
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2021/04/16/peloton-treadmill-injuries-death-cpsc/
341 comments
> Asked for a response, a spokesperson for Peloton, Jessica Kleiman, told Insider that the company was "disappointed that CPSC is mischaracterizing the situation."
The hubris...
The only correct response would have been something along the lines of "we have no comment at this time."
The job is to communicate that you are aware of an issue, that you are investigating, and/or that you are cooperating. If you want to lobby for favorable treatment from regulators, hire an external lobbying firm to do it quietly, don't get into a public flame war with the CPSC.
How are PR/spokespeople for high profile companies still making these kind of amateur hour mistakes in 2021? Isn't the public record absolutely littered with comments like these that just made the company look worse?
The hubris...
The only correct response would have been something along the lines of "we have no comment at this time."
The job is to communicate that you are aware of an issue, that you are investigating, and/or that you are cooperating. If you want to lobby for favorable treatment from regulators, hire an external lobbying firm to do it quietly, don't get into a public flame war with the CPSC.
How are PR/spokespeople for high profile companies still making these kind of amateur hour mistakes in 2021? Isn't the public record absolutely littered with comments like these that just made the company look worse?
When my parents were children, everyone heated their houses with an open fire, and if you did something wrong on any day it would kill you. When I was a child, we had a boiler which was perfectly safe so long as you paid someone to service it once a year. Pretty much all the things my parents grew up with had no safety features, pretty much all the things I grew up with did.
We have moved to a society where things are expected to be safe except for a number of well known exceptions, and this is good:
"It is a profoundly erroneous truism, repeated by all copy-books and by eminent people when they are making speeches, that we should cultivate the habit of thinking of what we are doing. The precise opposite is the case. Civilization advances by extending the number of important operations which we can perform without thinking about them. Operations of thought are like cavalry charges in a battle — they are strictly limited in number, they require fresh horses, and must only be made at decisive moments. " Alfred North Whitehead
As technologists it is our business to know and understand the consequences of the mechanisms we build. We value greater understanding and perception. But it is a mistake to project this value system onto society as a whole, since, as the quote shows, the worth of what we build is precisely to allow others to avoid this burden. That applies in safety as much as anything else. As technologists we can see that if a device has a 500W motor in it , it bears thinking about whether there are any safety issues. But consumers rightly expect any safety issues to be pointed out to them.
What worries me is when companies are run by people who don't understand that all our safety is the result of a lot of work, and so don't realise the amount of diligence required.
We have moved to a society where things are expected to be safe except for a number of well known exceptions, and this is good:
"It is a profoundly erroneous truism, repeated by all copy-books and by eminent people when they are making speeches, that we should cultivate the habit of thinking of what we are doing. The precise opposite is the case. Civilization advances by extending the number of important operations which we can perform without thinking about them. Operations of thought are like cavalry charges in a battle — they are strictly limited in number, they require fresh horses, and must only be made at decisive moments. " Alfred North Whitehead
As technologists it is our business to know and understand the consequences of the mechanisms we build. We value greater understanding and perception. But it is a mistake to project this value system onto society as a whole, since, as the quote shows, the worth of what we build is precisely to allow others to avoid this burden. That applies in safety as much as anything else. As technologists we can see that if a device has a 500W motor in it , it bears thinking about whether there are any safety issues. But consumers rightly expect any safety issues to be pointed out to them.
What worries me is when companies are run by people who don't understand that all our safety is the result of a lot of work, and so don't realise the amount of diligence required.
This messes up my view of the whole company, as well as my afternoon. I was just starting to get interested in Peloton but since I hadn't gotten into it, it's easy to drop the idea.
I hope their reasoning isn't that a child shouldn't have used it. Kids love video games. They need to figure out how to minimize the risk in addition to doing all they can to prevent kids from using it.
I hope their reasoning isn't that a child shouldn't have used it. Kids love video games. They need to figure out how to minimize the risk in addition to doing all they can to prevent kids from using it.
Pelotron's previous fiasco: pedal breakage on exercise bikes.[1] 120 pedal breaks reported to the CDC, 16 leg injuries. That's embarrassing. Pedal breakage is rare on real bikes, where weight reduction matters. Having them break on an expensive exercise bike, where neither weight nor cost matters, is a bit much.
[1] https://www.cpsc.gov/Recalls/2020/peloton-recalls-pr70p-bike...
[1] https://www.cpsc.gov/Recalls/2020/peloton-recalls-pr70p-bike...
Is it an American thing to vigorously defend corporations from accountability to the public?
Twitter and even here seem full of people defending Peloton when clearly there have been enough incidents to warrant some design changes.
It seems like a lot of people want to advocate returning to a time where businesses had little responsibility when it came to the dangerous products they churned out.
There are plenty of developing countries where this is still the case and lots of people/children unnecessarily die as a result. I imagine it would be hell to live in a place where many innocuous products are dangerous and people reguarly lose their kids. I don't want to live in that world.
Twitter and even here seem full of people defending Peloton when clearly there have been enough incidents to warrant some design changes.
It seems like a lot of people want to advocate returning to a time where businesses had little responsibility when it came to the dangerous products they churned out.
There are plenty of developing countries where this is still the case and lots of people/children unnecessarily die as a result. I imagine it would be hell to live in a place where many innocuous products are dangerous and people reguarly lose their kids. I don't want to live in that world.
I've read a lot of the comments here condemning Peloton, and I don't think I completely agree.
A treadmill is a big fast moving piece of gym equipment. It is definitely dangerous to kids, as are all treadmills. And what about like freeweights or those universal gyms with the plates that go up and down?
What about power tools? Or vacuum cleaners? Or plastic bags, or cleaning products, or whatever? Lots of stuff is dangerous for kids. This is not something for kids or suitable for use around kids, and it's hard to believe anyone thinks it would be. What happened is horrible, but I don't see why it should mean peloton cant make their product
A treadmill is a big fast moving piece of gym equipment. It is definitely dangerous to kids, as are all treadmills. And what about like freeweights or those universal gyms with the plates that go up and down?
What about power tools? Or vacuum cleaners? Or plastic bags, or cleaning products, or whatever? Lots of stuff is dangerous for kids. This is not something for kids or suitable for use around kids, and it's hard to believe anyone thinks it would be. What happened is horrible, but I don't see why it should mean peloton cant make their product
If all they can do is urge a recall, I don’t know if they should be called regulators.
Was like 12. Speed was set via a dial.
One would think a treadmill needed ramp up time to get to 15mph.
Life lessons were learned after being tossed into a filing cabinet.
One would think a treadmill needed ramp up time to get to 15mph.
Life lessons were learned after being tossed into a filing cabinet.
My $600 treadmill has a magnet on a string with a clip on the other end, and the magnet has to stay stuck to a surface continually or the motors don't run. I attach the clip to my clothing so if I slip and fall while using the treadmill, it yanks the magnet away and immediately disables the machine. I keep the magnet up high enough that young kids can't get to it. Seems like that can be a reasonable way to greatly reduce the risk of injury.
Has anyone purchased a Peloton and found it useful?
I'm not sure what it provides compared to a similar bike plus a tablet to watch the myriad videos on YouTube.
Is it some sort of exercise status symbol to show off to their peer group (e.g. like people posting their workouts on strava)?
These bikes and treadmills seem to be double the price of a similar quality machine from existing manufacturers + an ipad, so I don't understand what the draw is for these.
I'm not sure what it provides compared to a similar bike plus a tablet to watch the myriad videos on YouTube.
Is it some sort of exercise status symbol to show off to their peer group (e.g. like people posting their workouts on strava)?
These bikes and treadmills seem to be double the price of a similar quality machine from existing manufacturers + an ipad, so I don't understand what the draw is for these.
> The Consumer Product Safety Commission this week took the unusual step of issuing an administrative subpoena to require Peloton to disclose the name of the child who died and the family’s contact information
Can't believe the company sent out an email to all of its customers announcing that incident in the first place. That kind of thing never should have left the legal department.
Can't believe the company sent out an email to all of its customers announcing that incident in the first place. That kind of thing never should have left the legal department.
I have a hard time believing that there aren't very specific regulations for threadmills that address hazards. When I worked on a consumer robotics project we had to follow IEC standards which defined exactly how far a hand could reach to moving parts, how big a stop button must be, etc.
Url changed from https://www.businessinsider.com/regulators-urge-safety-recal..., which points to this.
The biggest issue is that Peloton is resisting fast changes and instant communication to prevent further injuries.
They do not deserve our trust.
And given that Peloton execs clearly know about this issue, they do deserve federal and civil legal action.
And given that Peloton execs clearly know about this issue, they do deserve federal and civil legal action.
What I’m not understanding, how is a Peloton more dangerous than a regular treadmill?
Probably not popular opinion:
Where were the parents in the video?
This is an adult gym equipment and it is not a toy. Why would regulator recall this?
For example, I am helping my son with weight training. I spot him. I never allow him to do it himself as he simply unable to control his strength yet. If he get hurt doing bench press himself for using too much weight without a spotter, is this the manufacturer’s problem or is it my problem? Of course it is my own negligence problem.
Where were the parents in the video?
This is an adult gym equipment and it is not a toy. Why would regulator recall this?
For example, I am helping my son with weight training. I spot him. I never allow him to do it himself as he simply unable to control his strength yet. If he get hurt doing bench press himself for using too much weight without a spotter, is this the manufacturer’s problem or is it my problem? Of course it is my own negligence problem.
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If this was a small company, wouldn't regulator simply shut it down?
For how much the idea of a dead toddler hurts, this is such a First World Problem.
Seems everybody who reads this headline instantaneously becomes an expert in the safe design of exercise equipment.
I need a key to start my Sole, and you can attach the key to yourself while operating it (in case you fall off). A child getting mangled under the tread couldn’t have happened with that simple mechanism in place.
Four IR sensors on a perimeter below the tread should do the job (interrupt the beam and it stops). Idk how companies come up with such non-safe products, even without regulation. It’s just a common sense to add some trivial safety to mechanisms.
It's more alarming that people are spending this amount of money (aka deploying factory labor, conveyor belts, induction motors, plastic molding, heart rate screens, grid electricity) for the ability to run in place like a hamster.
A recall seems excessive. My heart goes out to the families with injuries, but children shouldn't be playing on treadmills unsupervised. Adults get hurt on treadmills all the time, the danger wouldn't be less for a child.
Children get hurt on stuff. This is like those magnet toys that got banned because some kids ate them. Let's not, as a society, overreact to every little thing because the children.
Children get hurt on stuff. This is like those magnet toys that got banned because some kids ate them. Let's not, as a society, overreact to every little thing because the children.
I think all bicycles should be recalled. They kill far more people, kids included, per year. And their design is ridiculous -- 2 wheels? How could such an inherently unstable device pass regulatory scrutiny?
I really hope most of the commentators here never get positions of responsibility.
Few comments are questioning why "Peloton" or are just making stuff up, like missing guards.
~3 people die a year from treadmills in the USA.
"In 2009, former boxer Mike Tyson’s daughter died when she got caught in a cord from a treadmill and accidentally hung herself"
> One of those fatalities involved a 5-year-old child, but it was not clear what occurred in that case
This is not hard to find - "Ashim Gurung died of compression of the neck, the Allegheny County Medical Examiner's Office determined."
"at least 2,600 children a year land in the emergency room from treadmills alone, according to Kim Dulic"
" in 2001, 12 children in separate incidents in Philadelphia suffered injuries from treadmill accidents. Six of them got their hands caught in the belts and suffered abrasions and resulting scar tissue so severe that they required plastic surgery to just to be able to open their hands again."
So why Peloton other than it's hip to say bad things about Peloton? Is that the value of that child's life, not to learn, but to be hip?
Few comments are questioning why "Peloton" or are just making stuff up, like missing guards.
~3 people die a year from treadmills in the USA.
"In 2009, former boxer Mike Tyson’s daughter died when she got caught in a cord from a treadmill and accidentally hung herself"
> One of those fatalities involved a 5-year-old child, but it was not clear what occurred in that case
This is not hard to find - "Ashim Gurung died of compression of the neck, the Allegheny County Medical Examiner's Office determined."
"at least 2,600 children a year land in the emergency room from treadmills alone, according to Kim Dulic"
" in 2001, 12 children in separate incidents in Philadelphia suffered injuries from treadmill accidents. Six of them got their hands caught in the belts and suffered abrasions and resulting scar tissue so severe that they required plastic surgery to just to be able to open their hands again."
So why Peloton other than it's hip to say bad things about Peloton? Is that the value of that child's life, not to learn, but to be hip?
Edit: confirmed (warning: video shows a child being injured): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onXNnlCYJ4Y