Ask HN: Best Plug Computer or energy efficient server?
11 comments
Just a warning about the GuruPlug Server Plus, I ordered mine on 5/28/2010 and still have not received it. They identified an issue with overheating and have not shipped out any models in a couple of months. After finally getting in touch with them I was told it would ship in mid july and I'm still waiting for it.
Actually looks like they just made a statement a couple of days ago about the issue https://www.globalscaletechnologies.com/news.aspx
It looks like GuruPlug is closer to 15W (3A @ 5V).
Note that the power supply's rating is not indicative of the machine's usual consumption. When all else fails, you really should hook these things up to something like a Kill-A-Watt to measure it.
Yes, you're right, I assume the max draw is 15W, probably 5W at idle and perhaps an average of 10W?
Anyway it's much less than 175W-185W I'm using now with a Core i7 as a 24x7 server...
Anyway it's much less than 175W-185W I'm using now with a Core i7 as a 24x7 server...
I've had positive results with the pcengines alix boards for routers: http://www.pcengines.ch/alix.htm . I suspect they'd work well for other server use.
I spent quite a few days tinkering with putting linux onto a nas device which was a lot of hassle and didn't perform well (music streaming).
In the end I just got an cheap fanless atom board and was done in a few hours. Obviously not as power efficient as a plug computer, but way more time efficient. There's a lot to be said for staying with the mainstream x86 distros etc.
In the end I just got an cheap fanless atom board and was done in a few hours. Obviously not as power efficient as a plug computer, but way more time efficient. There's a lot to be said for staying with the mainstream x86 distros etc.
What about an Acer Aspire Revo 1600 to use like a server and also as a mediacenter connected to the bigscreen tv?
16-20W idle.
I'm not trying to build an HTPC/PVR, so I don't even need video out - ssh connection would be enough.
I'm looking for something minimalist: Minimal size, minimal prize, minimal power consumption.
I'm looking for something minimalist: Minimal size, minimal prize, minimal power consumption.
"High performance" precludes the SheevaPlug/GuruPlug/etc, surely? What do you mean by "high performance"?
I am setting up a Fit-PC2i currently, which at least has the power of a netbook.
I am setting up a Fit-PC2i currently, which at least has the power of a netbook.
Well, it doesn't need to be able to perform advanced calculations for the LHC in Switzerland, but it must have enough CPU juice to be reliable as a server. Perhaps HTTP/FTP/POP3/DNS server, download server, Firewall, there are many possible uses and I think that GuruPlug and their kind provide enough CPU performance for such tasks.
I'm concerned about what I read about problems with overheating, though.
I'm concerned about what I read about problems with overheating, though.
The "CPU juice" required of a server, per page sent, is fairly low compared to the "juice" a client uses to run the browser that page is rendered in. Run munin, awstats, and top to get a feel for your server load: you should get a sense of how much it takes to manage one user, and how many simultaneous users you have, etc. For development, assuming you have another machine for your GUI, a 400 MHz Apple G3 B&W with 256 MB RAM will run Debian Lenny with Apache and PHP just fine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_Macintosh_G3_%28Blue_%26_...), so I would think any of the plugs would be fine. If you are deploying a service and marketing it to millions, you're going to need a bit more than a plug :-)
Yes, of course it's not intended to run a service for millions of users, it is mainly http server for developing purposes, file serving (scp, ftp), perhaps dns server and firewall.
Server!=high performance, a server can be any device that's mostly on and connected to the network. None of the services you mention are "high performance", except perhaps the firewall if you have a lot of traffic and a lot of rules. Also, don't host your own e-mail. Your server will go down, and you will lose mail, and it will be embarrassing.
If you can afford an Core i7 server right now, you might consider a Mac Mini. When idle it consumes less than 10W(http://www.apple.com/macmini/environment.html). And when you need the power, you got it.
I'm using one at least and I'm very happy with it.
I'm using one at least and I'm very happy with it.
Reliability is a key factor for me with low-power being important, too. I've been running Mac Minis as servers since they first came out. Right now I have ~25 of them running at the MIT Museum, about half of those run exhibits and shut themselves off from 11PM to 8AM, a couple are used for desktops, the rest are running 24x7, some as servers, some as development machines. I've never had a Mac mini die. I'm in the process of moving our internal file server from a PowerMac G5 to a Mini.
We just got our first new, low-profile Mini and it's great. Not having to deal with the power brick is a huge win, and the power cord seats much more firmly than the old cords do.
I'm also experimenting with two Eee Box B202's running Ubuntu. One has been running 24x7 for the last 6 months without any problems.
Plug computers are interesting and for a while I thought they could make good controllers for touch-screen kiosks. But the iPad pretty much blows away anything we could put together with a plug, a USB display driver and a monitor (except in screen size).
We just got our first new, low-profile Mini and it's great. Not having to deal with the power brick is a huge win, and the power cord seats much more firmly than the old cords do.
I'm also experimenting with two Eee Box B202's running Ubuntu. One has been running 24x7 for the last 6 months without any problems.
Plug computers are interesting and for a while I thought they could make good controllers for touch-screen kiosks. But the iPad pretty much blows away anything we could put together with a plug, a USB display driver and a monitor (except in screen size).
Mac Minis are great but in this case I think they are overkill. Starting at $699 and 2.4Ghz Core 2 Duo, NVIDIA GeForce 320M it is more expensive that what I had in mind, and more powerful than what I need.
I could buy 3 GuruPlug Server at $129 to separate responsibilities and have one dedicated to http serving, another for file serving (using it like a NAS, scp/ftps server, smb/nfs) and another for firewall, and all of them would cost half than a Mac Mini.
I could buy 3 GuruPlug Server at $129 to separate responsibilities and have one dedicated to http serving, another for file serving (using it like a NAS, scp/ftps server, smb/nfs) and another for firewall, and all of them would cost half than a Mac Mini.
You definitely can hit different sweet spots with plugs vs Minis. That's one reason I was playing with the Eee Box. They cost just under $300 with a decent amount of RAM and disk, plus HD DVI out. If you don't need a display then even that's overkill.
If you watch the Apple Store carefully you can snag a refurbished core 2 duo mini for $499 or so. Full warranty. I've never had a problem with Apple refurb stuff.
Might be especially convenient if the system you're using worked seamlessly with the Time Machine's automatic backup. What's been your experience?
I'm even going one step further than just backing up that Mini server. I've got other dedicated servers running Debian GNU/Linux. On those I wrote specialized backup scripts for various installations: DB, mail, web apps, misc. daemons. Those backups get zipped up and put in a secure web accessible folder. When the backup is deployed a mail is written, my Mini receives it and downloads the backup.
And yes, the Mini itself has Timemachine as its backup(;
And yes, the Mini itself has Timemachine as its backup(;
I use a dell mini 9 for my business. It sits in a closed ventless cabinet and hasn't overheated. It uses <7w with wifi and screen on, but mine are off. Also, there are no moving parts and it's got a built in UPS... I got it new for $199 last year.
I've also found the netbook route an excellent choice. http://www.museum.zoo.cam.ac.uk/ runs beautifully on a Dell Mini 10v with Ubuntu Server.
The Excito Bubba Two looks promising. Has anyone here used one?
Really nice, and it is linux (Debian) based, and provides ssh access with root privileges.
https://www.excito.com/bubba/products/technical-specificatio...
And is silent (even 0db with a SSD)
https://www.excito.com/bubba/products/technical-specificatio...
And is silent (even 0db with a SSD)
I like the Intel Atom's. I have a mini-atx case with MSI Intel Atom board with two gigabit ethernet ports.
Still tempted to upgrade to newer Atom to be able to go completely passive system. Combine with SSD drive and totally silent server.
I have a sheeva plug. It's been running my home phone system (based on Asterisk) for the last year or so. It was easy to set up and has worked well for me. Several services are running on it, including apache, which serves a webpage i use to get my voicemail. I'm not sure exactly what you mean by 'high performance', but it does the trick for me.
I know you're already aware of it, just thought I'd share my experience.
I know you're already aware of it, just thought I'd share my experience.
Thank you for sharing your experience!! Any issues with overheating?
I find GuruPlug Server Plus specially interesting, it's small, consumes less than 5W and costs less than $150, but I've read that it's got issues with overheating.
Do you know a good alternative? A PlugComputer or another low power, cheap computer to use as a 24x7 server?