What Do You Tell People You Are?(thecodist.com)
thecodist.com
What Do You Tell People You Are?
http://thecodist.com/article/what_do_you_tell_people_you_are_and_what_you_do
33 comments
I've always gone with the domain, rather than the task.
Me: "I build medical instruments"
Them: "Oh." sometimes followed by "like what?"
Me: "Blood test machines"
Them: "Cool. You like football?"
Most people have little idea what a computer programmer does. But they can understand that when a nurse takes their blood it goes into an instrument that measures different things about it and that's good enough for them.
Me: "I build medical instruments"
Them: "Oh." sometimes followed by "like what?"
Me: "Blood test machines"
Them: "Cool. You like football?"
Most people have little idea what a computer programmer does. But they can understand that when a nurse takes their blood it goes into an instrument that measures different things about it and that's good enough for them.
I write code.
Some people think that diminishes what I do. I don't just sit at a computer and type code in from start to end. I have to plan, design, revise, and test. I have to read and criticize. I have to consider very high-level structures and very low-level structures. Therefore, I should say I do something much grander than "write code." Something about "science" or "engineering."
It's surely not science. Calling it "engineering" would be fair. Sometimes I do. I don't see what's wrong with calling it "writing," though. After all, don't I write code principally for other humans to understand, and only incidentally for machines to execute? Writers plan, imagine, write, revise, test, and rewrite. Writers read and criticize. Writers consider high-level structures and low-level structures. Writers produce rivers of words one afternoon and struggle with a single line the next. Writers excise large sections of their work with mixed feelings of triumph and regret.
Writing code is what I do. If the language had evolved differently, I would be proud to call myself a "code writer" or simply a "writer." The closest equivalent seems to be "programmer," so that's what I call myself. Or, on my resume, as a concession to corporate dullness, a software engineer.
Some people think that diminishes what I do. I don't just sit at a computer and type code in from start to end. I have to plan, design, revise, and test. I have to read and criticize. I have to consider very high-level structures and very low-level structures. Therefore, I should say I do something much grander than "write code." Something about "science" or "engineering."
It's surely not science. Calling it "engineering" would be fair. Sometimes I do. I don't see what's wrong with calling it "writing," though. After all, don't I write code principally for other humans to understand, and only incidentally for machines to execute? Writers plan, imagine, write, revise, test, and rewrite. Writers read and criticize. Writers consider high-level structures and low-level structures. Writers produce rivers of words one afternoon and struggle with a single line the next. Writers excise large sections of their work with mixed feelings of triumph and regret.
Writing code is what I do. If the language had evolved differently, I would be proud to call myself a "code writer" or simply a "writer." The closest equivalent seems to be "programmer," so that's what I call myself. Or, on my resume, as a concession to corporate dullness, a software engineer.
Depending on the audience, I say "typist.. but this trick is knowing what to type." About 70% of the time, people will say something along the lines of "isn't that what most people do?", to which i smirk in that creepy self-satisfied fashion and admit "exactly."
Funny, I was just referencing this issue the other day.
When people ask me what I do, I say "computer stuff", and occasionally I'll lift my hands and kind of type at a non-existent keyboard. They invariably go "oh" -- to date, not one has said "ok, but what KIND of computer stuff?" which would be my own personal response.
This tells me I'm either consistently gauging their level of computer savvy pretty accurately, or that occasionally I come off like a bit of a dick. YMMV.
When people ask me what I do, I say "computer stuff", and occasionally I'll lift my hands and kind of type at a non-existent keyboard. They invariably go "oh" -- to date, not one has said "ok, but what KIND of computer stuff?" which would be my own personal response.
This tells me I'm either consistently gauging their level of computer savvy pretty accurately, or that occasionally I come off like a bit of a dick. YMMV.
You're not being a dick. It's generally correct to say something short (eg "I teach high school") and to go for brevity over correctness. If the person shows interest then you can launch into the details (and probably glaze their eyes).
Same here. 'Computer stuff' is simple and to the point, sometimes they'll ask for more details but usually not.
It's so hard for me to put a single label on myself because I do so many different things. I'm a freelance writer, SEO, programmer, marketer, PR-person and much, much more.
It's so hard for me to put a single label on myself because I do so many different things. I'm a freelance writer, SEO, programmer, marketer, PR-person and much, much more.
Same response for most people. :)
I usually just tell people I'm a programmer. If you say you're a writer, that tends to provoke some people into an attempt to discover whether you're "really" a writer, which in their minds equates with making your whole living from it. Despite the prevalence of open source, this sort of person tends to believe that no one would write code except for money, so they'll usually take your word for it if you say you're a programmer. Even though in fact I make some money from writing and none from programming.
Same here. I am a programmer, but I spend so much time making comics that I consider it a second, very low-paying job. When people ask me what I do, I say programmer so I don't have to justify myself.
And people understand what programmers do, that's easier to imagine than many other jobs. My father was a marketing manager and I grew up not really knowing what he did.
And people understand what programmers do, that's easier to imagine than many other jobs. My father was a marketing manager and I grew up not really knowing what he did.
oh come on, you've got to at least plug your comic!
Oh well, it's in french. Here is a link to something I put online last year:
http://grandpapier.org/La-presse-independante
But most of what I publish is in print, and some is out-of-print. I know I should put more effort in making my things available, but this definitely has a lower priority than making new comics.
(hrm. I notice only now I was replying to a comment by pg. It made absolutely no sense to write 'same here')
http://grandpapier.org/La-presse-independante
But most of what I publish is in print, and some is out-of-print. I know I should put more effort in making my things available, but this definitely has a lower priority than making new comics.
(hrm. I notice only now I was replying to a comment by pg. It made absolutely no sense to write 'same here')
I belive this phenomenon comes from the fact that for certain people, the "artiste" is a superior human being. Someone who belongs to a special caste. So they don't want to let you come through with it untested. Envious.
for certain people, the "artiste" is a superior human being
Ha. Yeah, those people are confused young women and other artists.
Someone who belongs to a special caste.
Most other people (parents, employers, non-confused women) do consider artists to belong to a special caste: the financially destitute, irresponsible "untouchable" caste.
Spoken from experience as an artist.
To answer the OP, I say programmer when asked by most people, "artist" when asked by confused young women.
Ha. Yeah, those people are confused young women and other artists.
Someone who belongs to a special caste.
Most other people (parents, employers, non-confused women) do consider artists to belong to a special caste: the financially destitute, irresponsible "untouchable" caste.
Spoken from experience as an artist.
To answer the OP, I say programmer when asked by most people, "artist" when asked by confused young women.
I think most people don't consider artists are superior, but everybody tends to ask these questions. I think it's more a need to fit people into categories.
Wouldn't it be more accurate to just say you're an investor?
I probably spend more time writing actually.
Even though in fact I make some money from writing and none from programming.
This is humorous to me because in attempting to learn how to make money as a writer (online), I was dragged into learning how to wrestle with code, development and design. So now in fact I make more money doing those things than I ever did from writing.
So when people ask what I do, I tell them "it depends on the day." Not sure I've ever had anybody ask me what I am . . . though that could make for an interesting philosophical conversation. Dust, anyone?
This is humorous to me because in attempting to learn how to make money as a writer (online), I was dragged into learning how to wrestle with code, development and design. So now in fact I make more money doing those things than I ever did from writing.
So when people ask what I do, I tell them "it depends on the day." Not sure I've ever had anybody ask me what I am . . . though that could make for an interesting philosophical conversation. Dust, anyone?
I think he's greatly overestimating how well people understand engineering jobs. Half the time when I tell people I'm an electrical engineer, they go, "Oh, like an electrician?".
Also, I've never met anyone outside of engineering who knew what a P.E. license is.
Also, I've never met anyone outside of engineering who knew what a P.E. license is.
Definitely true. My dad worked as an instrumentation engineer (valves, gauges, etc.) in the oil and gas industry before retiring. I don't think anyone has ever known immediately what I was talking about if they didn't also happen to work in the oil and gas industry in a technical capacity. Most folks have no idea what someone in pretty much any technical field does.
He forgets to mention "Computational Mathematician". Computer stuff is more often like math than it is like science. Out of math, science, and engineering, I would say it is like science the least.
I hereby request to be called an "applied computational mathematician".
Although, often I get the feeling that I am a sort of wizard in training; constantly learning new spells (programming techniques) to apply to new situations. So I will also accept "apprentice computational warlock".
I hereby request to be called an "applied computational mathematician".
Although, often I get the feeling that I am a sort of wizard in training; constantly learning new spells (programming techniques) to apply to new situations. So I will also accept "apprentice computational warlock".
on that train of thought I am called a 'technomancer' by my family,and have addopted the term for public use. apperently fixing things that you seem to know very littl about is a skill. I am also the official dvd player/cable box/game system expert and operator of my household. my family has now decided that they are toast when I go to college.
I like it! I might try "technomancer" out some. But not with girls that I am meeting for the first time.
I always tell people I'm a programmer. I don't really like terms like "software engineer" or "architect".
This is largely because I think programming needs to stand on its own as a discipline. Sometimes I think people are worried that they'll be perceived as "merely a coder", so they play up the non-coding aspects of their jobs in their titles. Personally, I don't know a single programmer who "merely codes", and I rarely encounter a coding project that I'd use "mere" to describe anyway.
I also avoid the term "engineer" because I don't want engineers to start thinking they have a claim on programming, especially with regard to these PE initiatives in software engineering. Maybe this is because I was a math major, but these people worry me.
This is largely because I think programming needs to stand on its own as a discipline. Sometimes I think people are worried that they'll be perceived as "merely a coder", so they play up the non-coding aspects of their jobs in their titles. Personally, I don't know a single programmer who "merely codes", and I rarely encounter a coding project that I'd use "mere" to describe anyway.
I also avoid the term "engineer" because I don't want engineers to start thinking they have a claim on programming, especially with regard to these PE initiatives in software engineering. Maybe this is because I was a math major, but these people worry me.
I usually tell people I'm a programmer. Sure, it doesn't sound as nice as "Software Engineer", but it gives most people a decent-enough idea of what I do - I sit in front of a computer and make software.
It doesn't matter than people don't know exactly what I do day-to-day, since the same thing is true of almost any other profession.
It doesn't matter than people don't know exactly what I do day-to-day, since the same thing is true of almost any other profession.
Depends on who it is.
Cute girls, I'll usually say something to get a reaction, like "I have a technology company. You know, on the Internet." When they follow up with, "Like what?" The response is "Mostly porn." If they take me seriously, they're probably not going to get the real explanation, anyway, so I have a little fun with the porn explanation, making it more and more outlandish until they realize I'm joking. I often tell myself that this is merely for amusement, and that what I actually do for a living is not far more embarrassing (due to being really boring to most people) than running a porn empire.
Other technology people, "I started a company that builds systems management software for web hosting."
Regular folks, "Computer stuff." Very similar to vasudeva's response. The only flaw in this tactic is that every once in a while, you'll meet someone who also does "computer stuff" (or their nephew or son or cousin does), and they'll want to "talk shop" about their website where they sell their knitted dog hats, or whatever MLM scheme they've most recently signed up for that includes a website. Or ask me ridiculous questions about hacking GMail or facebook or something equally retarded (depending on age and demographic).
Cute girls, I'll usually say something to get a reaction, like "I have a technology company. You know, on the Internet." When they follow up with, "Like what?" The response is "Mostly porn." If they take me seriously, they're probably not going to get the real explanation, anyway, so I have a little fun with the porn explanation, making it more and more outlandish until they realize I'm joking. I often tell myself that this is merely for amusement, and that what I actually do for a living is not far more embarrassing (due to being really boring to most people) than running a porn empire.
Other technology people, "I started a company that builds systems management software for web hosting."
Regular folks, "Computer stuff." Very similar to vasudeva's response. The only flaw in this tactic is that every once in a while, you'll meet someone who also does "computer stuff" (or their nephew or son or cousin does), and they'll want to "talk shop" about their website where they sell their knitted dog hats, or whatever MLM scheme they've most recently signed up for that includes a website. Or ask me ridiculous questions about hacking GMail or facebook or something equally retarded (depending on age and demographic).
What, you mean you don't want to talk to their nephew who is "also really into those computer things" (read: plays a lot of world of warcraft).
Yes, I'm bitter. It annoys me that people thing that IT consists of helping you with your num lock button, blocking them from porn, and doing lots of things with cables.
Yes, I'm bitter. It annoys me that people thing that IT consists of helping you with your num lock button, blocking them from porn, and doing lots of things with cables.
About 8 years ago I was flying from the East Coast out to San Francisco for a programming gig. As I sat in the plane, getting started for my trip, I happened to ask the guy next to me what he did.
"I'm a dentist," he said, quite proud of himself, "and what do you do?"
"I do computer stuff mostly," I mumbled.
The guy -- I swear -- spent the next 5 hours of the flight telling me about how he wanted to computerize his dental office but his partner didn't understand things, how he was having problems with some software they had purchased, how he was looking to buy a new computer and didn't know what to get. For each subject, he questioned me at length for what I thought he should do.
Finally, at the end of the flight just before we got off, I opened my mouth as wide as I could and pointed to the back of my throat
"Doc," I said, "I got this sore tooth that only acts up when I eat ice cream, but sometimes the gum swells so I've been using a special toothpaste. Care to take a look?"
That was the end of that.
"I'm a dentist," he said, quite proud of himself, "and what do you do?"
"I do computer stuff mostly," I mumbled.
The guy -- I swear -- spent the next 5 hours of the flight telling me about how he wanted to computerize his dental office but his partner didn't understand things, how he was having problems with some software they had purchased, how he was looking to buy a new computer and didn't know what to get. For each subject, he questioned me at length for what I thought he should do.
Finally, at the end of the flight just before we got off, I opened my mouth as wide as I could and pointed to the back of my throat
"Doc," I said, "I got this sore tooth that only acts up when I eat ice cream, but sometimes the gum swells so I've been using a special toothpaste. Care to take a look?"
That was the end of that.
On that note, even though HN is not usually well suited to jokes, I'll contribute this one:
--
A lawyer and a doctor meet up at a party. They're chatting, and the doctor tells the lawyer "You know what really bugs me? When I tell people I'm a doctor, they always end up telling me about their health and basically asking me to diagnose them right there and then. They don't seem to care that I'm, say, at a party, and that I don't want to spent my party time working."
"I know exactly what you mean. Used to happen to me all the time with legal advice."
"Oh really? Can I ask you... what did you do to stop people asking you legal questions at parties?"
The lawyer eyes him up. "Sure. Here's the trick. I answer the question, graciously, efficiently. Then, the next day, I send them an invoice."
"Oh, that's really great!"
They enjoy the party and then go home. The next day, the doctor receives an invoice in the mail.
--
Perhaps we should start invoicing our friends for tech support work?
--
A lawyer and a doctor meet up at a party. They're chatting, and the doctor tells the lawyer "You know what really bugs me? When I tell people I'm a doctor, they always end up telling me about their health and basically asking me to diagnose them right there and then. They don't seem to care that I'm, say, at a party, and that I don't want to spent my party time working."
"I know exactly what you mean. Used to happen to me all the time with legal advice."
"Oh really? Can I ask you... what did you do to stop people asking you legal questions at parties?"
The lawyer eyes him up. "Sure. Here's the trick. I answer the question, graciously, efficiently. Then, the next day, I send them an invoice."
"Oh, that's really great!"
They enjoy the party and then go home. The next day, the doctor receives an invoice in the mail.
--
Perhaps we should start invoicing our friends for tech support work?
That's kinda how my dad ended up a lawyer.
He called a guy for some legal advice (a taxi had driven through his storefront, trashing the place). He got the lawyers' bill the next week or so.
Decided law school might be a good idea, soon after.
He called a guy for some legal advice (a taxi had driven through his storefront, trashing the place). He got the lawyers' bill the next week or so.
Decided law school might be a good idea, soon after.
The worst thing is that everyone expects you to help them with their IT problems. Over the phone.
Its worst with relatives, I just can't say "no" to my dad. Anybody else i can either tell to call me later(if he is my friend), or to get lost(depending on my mood, I may say this politely).
That is the thing! My dad paid for college so I can't just tell him no, I will not help.
My dad is a reader - if there is a problem he will read everything on the screen over the telephone - even if it takes an hour. It is absolute torture to help him (or my mother). But then again, an hour of IT- waterboarding is a small price to pay for someone who changed your diapers.
My dad is a reader - if there is a problem he will read everything on the screen over the telephone - even if it takes an hour. It is absolute torture to help him (or my mother). But then again, an hour of IT- waterboarding is a small price to pay for someone who changed your diapers.
Get logmein. It's free and will save you hours of potential tech support headaches :).
I just bought a notebook computer to give to my mom in Florida at the end of the month. She's 74 and she wants to keep up with the kids and grandkids on the internet, although she has no idea what that means. My mom thinks cell phones are the epitome of hi-tech. The last time she used a keyboard it was an electric typewriter and the year was 1990.
I'm thinking about changing my number.
I'm thinking about changing my number.
I've found the best answer to that is "I only do theoretical Computer Science."
If you do it while other computer scientists are in hearing range the look on their face will be worth it.
If you do it while other computer scientists are in hearing range the look on their face will be worth it.
I refuse to help people with their computers unless I can remote control them. Even then it's only for close enough friends and family.
Programmer != Technitian :(
Programmer != Technitian :(
I have a little fun with the porn explanation, making it more and more outlandish until they realize I'm joking
Are you sure that embarrassing/fooling those cute girls increases your chances with them? :)
Are you sure that embarrassing/fooling those cute girls increases your chances with them? :)
Oh, on that count, I have no doubt.
I've long ago learned that nice nerds pretty much never get the girl, unless they dramatically lower their standards for what makes a compatible mate. Nerds that make girls laugh and don't kowtow to their every whim, on the other hand, very often do get the girl. Girls are interesting and complex systems.
I should also add, it was a girl flirting with me that introduced me to the idea. She asked what I did, I told her I worked in technology, "Internet stuff", and she responded with, "Oh, so you run a porn website?" I thought it was funny, and it just automatically became my default response.
I've long ago learned that nice nerds pretty much never get the girl, unless they dramatically lower their standards for what makes a compatible mate. Nerds that make girls laugh and don't kowtow to their every whim, on the other hand, very often do get the girl. Girls are interesting and complex systems.
I should also add, it was a girl flirting with me that introduced me to the idea. She asked what I did, I told her I worked in technology, "Internet stuff", and she responded with, "Oh, so you run a porn website?" I thought it was funny, and it just automatically became my default response.
Yeah but being nice doesn't mean kowtowing to their every whim. It doesn't get you very far either though.
"I write software" is typically where I start and if the other person wants more information we can go down the rabbit hole from there.
Funny story though, my wife and I are friends with Eric Meyer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Meyer) and if we're in a group and other people ask him what he does, my wife jumps in and says he fixes printers. You should see his face :-)
Funny story though, my wife and I are friends with Eric Meyer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Meyer) and if we're in a group and other people ask him what he does, my wife jumps in and says he fixes printers. You should see his face :-)
I just tell people I make the websites.
As a joke, I make developer and pornographer interchangeable. Too bad I don't do back-end work.
As a joke, I make developer and pornographer interchangeable. Too bad I don't do back-end work.
Can you make a social networking site for me? You'll have to do it for free, but I'll give you some of the stock.
or
inquire_cost(build_social_networking_site); while cost > 100 { bitch() moan() ask again() }
or
inquire_cost(build_social_networking_site); while cost > 100 { bitch() moan() ask again() }
Oh, I'd do it for free. Its just a simple Facebook clone.
If they look like they'll be remotely interested, I give them an actual quick description: "I run a business that sells websites to video game players."
On the other hand, if I don't really want to talk with them, I'll just give them the ol' "I'm a programmer."
On the other hand, if I don't really want to talk with them, I'll just give them the ol' "I'm a programmer."
Once I tried to chat up this girl in a party. I told her that I'm a programmer and her response was, "you're what? a problemmer?!"
These days I just tried to avoid the subject. It's lots of fun to talk about technology with hackers. With other people it's actually one of the worst topics to bring up.
If people ask, I say that I'm a technologist. If they press to know what it is that I actually do I tell them that I talk on the phone a lot, and sometimes write emails, which is partly true and something almost anyone can relate to. Then I change the subject.
These days I just tried to avoid the subject. It's lots of fun to talk about technology with hackers. With other people it's actually one of the worst topics to bring up.
If people ask, I say that I'm a technologist. If they press to know what it is that I actually do I tell them that I talk on the phone a lot, and sometimes write emails, which is partly true and something almost anyone can relate to. Then I change the subject.
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I usually say something like, "I'm a programmer. I make apps for the iPhone." As soon as I utter the word "programmer", I can see the light in their eyes begin to fade - but mentioning the iPhone brings them back and suddenly I'm a person with a cool job. The nice thing about being an iPhone dev is I can avoid the usual "computer stuff" response that results in doing tech support because people don't realize that the iPhone is just a computer platform. :) I also have the advantage of having previously worked for Tapulous (as one of the original employees, actually), so people who have an iPhone/iPod have almost universally heard of Tap Tap Revenge - which has/had a little of my code buried in there somewhere.
>As soon as I utter the word "programmer", I can see the light in their eyes begin to fade - but mentioning the iPhone brings them back and suddenly I'm a person with a cool job.
I know just the situation. It's game consoles instead of iPhone in my case though. If I talk with youngsters I usually top it with 'coin-op' and 'have more than 70 consoles in my house' for maximum bang :).
I know just the situation. It's game consoles instead of iPhone in my case though. If I talk with youngsters I usually top it with 'coin-op' and 'have more than 70 consoles in my house' for maximum bang :).
I just tell people I invest in startup companies or that I don't really have a job.
Professionally, I am a Software Engineer. Otherwise, I am a nerd.
Everything you had wanted to be :)
Engineer by training, entrepreneur by affliction.
Fancy typist.
I tell people I am a "Professional web surfer."
I tell people I'm a computer programmer, most of the time that's enough. Sure, that doesn't really tell them what I do, and sure, their eyes would glaze over if I talked about debugging or memory management, but so what? I don't really know what a brain surgeon does (besides 'operate on brains') and my eyes would probably glaze over if one started going into details of how they choose which scalpel or the details about _why_ they work on a particular brain.
Any complex job will be largely incomprehensible to people not in the field, if you think otherwise, there is a good chance you don't know how much you don't know.
Any complex job will be largely incomprehensible to people not in the field, if you think otherwise, there is a good chance you don't know how much you don't know.
Or you don't know how much you now. (When you are the insider thinking your job easy.)
I tell people I am a Software Developer. I'm not a programmer, though software development occasionally requires programming. I certainly don't say Software Engineer, because what we do doesn't resemble engineering, no matter how much adherents to various methodologies say we do.
I'm a runner. But what do you do to make a living. Computer stuff, sometimes, I'm not really good at it.
I used to say "I work for a financial software startup." Then it was "I'm starting a web software company." Now it's "I work for Google."
The latter seems to be by far the most effective explanation.
The latter seems to be by far the most effective explanation.
Software Engineer.
Surely the entrepreneur's answer to "What do you do?" is "Whatever it takes!"
I say "I make computers do what other people want them to do".
Careerwise, I answer "programmer, for TV news systems". That seems to work pretty well.
When explaining my hobby, "programming" seems to generate strong associations to Excel for some reason, so I usually answer "mathematics" instead.
When explaining my hobby, "programming" seems to generate strong associations to Excel for some reason, so I usually answer "mathematics" instead.
Sometimes I tell people I run a small business. I've done that many different things though, I'm not always sure what I do these days!
"I'm currently making cartoons" sums it up pretty much.
I really don't want to get into the specifics because you then see people's eyes glaze over.
I really don't want to get into the specifics because you then see people's eyes glaze over.
Then I say "I fix keyboards and mice for an investment bank", which usually ends up with some nervous laughs (some get it, some don't).
Then I say "I write software that run electronic trading systems, like stock exchanges". That's when most people get it. The others tend to think the finance world ends at their ATM.
Recently, the last sentence has ended up with dirty looks from those who probably think that people like me caused the current global recession. At this point I usually say something like "I don't work in credit derivatives".