Use YouTube to improve your English pronunciation(youglish.com)
youglish.com
Use YouTube to improve your English pronunciation
https://youglish.com/
250 comments
Not me. Rural was particularly bad and is a terribly difficult word for non-indo-european speakers. The video (I found this in a few words) starts RIGHT on the word (autocracy did this as well). Most of the time this doesn't happen though. I did wish it would default to a specific pronunciation too. Default to US or UK when selecting "All". Router I got UK, Aluminum I got US. Epoch I got (it says US) some weird bastardization of US and UK[0] (though with ML becoming really popular it seems that everyone is defaulting to the UK pronunciation - probably because the spelling - so maybe this should default to UK?).
There also seems to be a bias for Ted Talks. I definitely agree with the parent's point about how speeches are different. But I'm not sure that's necessarily bad. The intonation changes people make when in speeches/talks is one of over pronunciation rather than the under pronunciation that we do in everyday speak. This may be better for learning. Maybe both could exist though. A "proper" and "casual" one. I'd say the casual should bias towards things like videoblogers and probably twitch streamers would be a good/plentiful resource. Might want to filter some of the latter though (stick to good streamers and big things like GDQ). Sports events would also be a good one.
That being said I'm not trying to discourage this effort and honestly I really like it (and wish there was one for Chinese, is there?). English isn't easy and there are a lot of pronunciations (I picked out words that are edge cases). I have already recommended it to a friend.
Good job!
Edit: Friend (native Chinese) already knew about this (extra good job!)
[0] How it should sound https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/epoch (You can now tell all your ML friends that they are saying it wrong and win that great sense of superiority. Never mind that language is what is spoken, the dictionary is always right!)
video it linked: https://youglish.com/getcid/19634402/epoch
There also seems to be a bias for Ted Talks. I definitely agree with the parent's point about how speeches are different. But I'm not sure that's necessarily bad. The intonation changes people make when in speeches/talks is one of over pronunciation rather than the under pronunciation that we do in everyday speak. This may be better for learning. Maybe both could exist though. A "proper" and "casual" one. I'd say the casual should bias towards things like videoblogers and probably twitch streamers would be a good/plentiful resource. Might want to filter some of the latter though (stick to good streamers and big things like GDQ). Sports events would also be a good one.
That being said I'm not trying to discourage this effort and honestly I really like it (and wish there was one for Chinese, is there?). English isn't easy and there are a lot of pronunciations (I picked out words that are edge cases). I have already recommended it to a friend.
Good job!
Edit: Friend (native Chinese) already knew about this (extra good job!)
[0] How it should sound https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/epoch (You can now tell all your ML friends that they are saying it wrong and win that great sense of superiority. Never mind that language is what is spoken, the dictionary is always right!)
video it linked: https://youglish.com/getcid/19634402/epoch
I'm a native English speaker and "rural" is a genuinely weird word to pronounce. My pronunciation is halfway between "earl" with a leading "r" and just incoherently growling "rrrl".
I was thinking the same thing - I realized that when I say this word, it is always slurred. Your pronunciation is much like mine, and I'm not even sure it would sound correctly if it were different as it would put too much emphasis on the middle "r".
However, I'm sure there is a name for that "there but not there" letter.
However, I'm sure there is a name for that "there but not there" letter.
I think you got US for “aluminum” because the US is the only country that spells it that way.
It's "aluminum" in American English but also in Canadian English.
Canada retains UK and French-influenced spellings for quite a few other English words which America doesn't (e.g. centre & colour). But apparently North America agrees on how to spell and pronounce atomic element 13 in English.
Canada retains UK and French-influenced spellings for quite a few other English words which America doesn't (e.g. centre & colour). But apparently North America agrees on how to spell and pronounce atomic element 13 in English.
For "rural", I'd expect there to be significant differences between rhoticizing and other dialects.
I don't think so, as both "r"s are sounded (like at the start of a word in a non-rhotic accent). It's when the "r" is at the end of a sound that there's a difference: "are", "our", "letter", "arctic", "architecture", etc. (none of those "r"s are sounded in my non-rhotic New Zealand accent, edit: unless followed by a vowel sound, like "letter and").
US dialects have a big impact on the second "r". I'm not a linguist, and I'm terrible with the terminology. The proper pronunciation is to sound both /r/ in the same manner. Southern dialects probably won't, but it would be to different degree. Some Southerners would "slur" the second /r/ for something akin to /roo'-rəl/: two syllables, schwa in 2nd syllable, but the second /r/ is barely there. I don't know if there's a way to specify that in a pronunciation key. This is how I'd say it in casual conversation. I imagine that native speakers of languages without /r/ would probably miss the 2nd /r/ with this pronunciation.
Other Southerners with thicker accents would run it together like /roo'-əl/: two syllaables, schwa in the 2nd, no perceivable 2nd /r/.
There may even be a 3rd way: /rulr/ rhymes with earl.
Other Southerners with thicker accents would run it together like /roo'-əl/: two syllaables, schwa in the 2nd, no perceivable 2nd /r/.
There may even be a 3rd way: /rulr/ rhymes with earl.
I see. In all the British-derived non-rhotic accents I'm familiar with, the second "r" sounds basically the same as the first.
In terms of "correctness", the 2nd /r/ should always be there. There are so many flavors of English in the US with minor differences. Much like England, you can head 30 miles in a different direction, and you might find a group of people who speak markedly different than you.
German is one of the languages available in the dropdown menu. I just gave it a cursory try, but it seems to work well.
Cool! I didn't notice the dropdown menu the first time. I will definitely be using this, thanks!
Seconded. I still can't tell apart the first a's in Ratte vs Rathaus, and Germans assure me they're different and the difference breaks any attempts to make puns based on the two (Rathaus=city hall, but to my ear feels like Ratte-house/haus).
As a German I can assure you that both "a" in Ratte and Rathaus sound the same. The "a" in Rathaus is just spoken a bit longer and the following "t" is hardly pronounced, whereas the "a" in Ratte is spoken very short and the "t" is pronounced strongly. I hope that helps.
I.e., they have the same quality but different quantity, and German does distinguish vowels by length, so they are different sounds in the sense that two words that otherwise sound the same can be distinguished by vowel length. "Ratten" and "raten", for a relavent example, are not homophones and nor are "Massen" and "Maßen" (German learners might be frustrated to learn that in fact these two are opposites in some contexts).
A few remarks on methodology in linguistics (the science).
A phone is a class of sounds (as opposed to their instances which are all unique) that can be reliably described by articulatory or acoustic features (phonetics) or by patterns found in EEG (I'm thinking of MIT's voiceless mic).
A phoneme is another type of "sound" class used in linguistics and it is arguably the more important: phonemes, as studied in the context of a particular language, is the finite set of sounds (a few dozens at most) from which you build different words in that language. Phonemes always come in pairs, since they are defined as the minimal distinctive linguistic unit that can yield a difference in meaning.
Substitute /p/ with /f/ in/fear/ and you get /pear/, i.e. another word, a difference in meaning --> thus /p/ and /f/ are phonemes.
But substitute /r/ with /rrrrr/ in /Braveheart/ and you get the same word but with a scottish accent. These do not form a phonemic pair but allophonic variations of the same phoneme (here according to different geographic areas but they can also vary according to age, social status, gender, etc ...)
A phone is a class of sounds (as opposed to their instances which are all unique) that can be reliably described by articulatory or acoustic features (phonetics) or by patterns found in EEG (I'm thinking of MIT's voiceless mic).
A phoneme is another type of "sound" class used in linguistics and it is arguably the more important: phonemes, as studied in the context of a particular language, is the finite set of sounds (a few dozens at most) from which you build different words in that language. Phonemes always come in pairs, since they are defined as the minimal distinctive linguistic unit that can yield a difference in meaning.
Substitute /p/ with /f/ in/fear/ and you get /pear/, i.e. another word, a difference in meaning --> thus /p/ and /f/ are phonemes.
But substitute /r/ with /rrrrr/ in /Braveheart/ and you get the same word but with a scottish accent. These do not form a phonemic pair but allophonic variations of the same phoneme (here according to different geographic areas but they can also vary according to age, social status, gender, etc ...)
So ... can you accept "Ratten raus vom Rathaus" as a pun? Like, I can understand if it's too low-effort or obvious, but is it still a pun?
The two vowel lengths sound too different to me (native speaker) for this to really work. The difference is the difference between aː vs a in IPA. I'm struggling to find a similar vowel length example in English and Wikipedia only has examples with an Australian accent. :)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vowel_length#Contrastive_vowel...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vowel_length#Contrastive_vowel...
Yeah, it doesn't really exist in English. I'd even argue that the Australian pronunciation doesn't change the vowel length as much as it adds a chain shift [1] (similar to the Canadian/Algonquin "ou" pronunciation).
It's one of the most difficult things to pick up when learning Japanese as well. There are lots of words that are basically homophones except for vowel length and tone. To an English speaker they tend to sound identical, but to a Japanese speaker if you get it wrong the result is unintelligible. For example "地図" (in romaji: chizu and pronounce cheezu with a short "ee") is "map" and "チーズ" (in romaji: chiizu and pronounced cheezu with a long "ee") is "cheese" (though they have the same tones... I'm struggling to think of an example with different tones as well as vowel length).
The thing that helped me the most for this was singing songs. Once you understand that there is a necessary rhythm to the words, it makes it much easier to use that rhythm in speaking. Or at least it did for me -- YMMV.
[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_shift
It's one of the most difficult things to pick up when learning Japanese as well. There are lots of words that are basically homophones except for vowel length and tone. To an English speaker they tend to sound identical, but to a Japanese speaker if you get it wrong the result is unintelligible. For example "地図" (in romaji: chizu and pronounce cheezu with a short "ee") is "map" and "チーズ" (in romaji: chiizu and pronounced cheezu with a long "ee") is "cheese" (though they have the same tones... I'm struggling to think of an example with different tones as well as vowel length).
The thing that helped me the most for this was singing songs. Once you understand that there is a necessary rhythm to the words, it makes it much easier to use that rhythm in speaking. Or at least it did for me -- YMMV.
[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_shift
Fun for foreigners (both in Tokyo area):
Itabashi Station: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Itabashi_Station
Iidabashi_Station https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iidabashi_Station
(the major difference you hear is the long ii, rather than the t/d difference)
Itabashi Station: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Itabashi_Station
Iidabashi_Station https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iidabashi_Station
(the major difference you hear is the long ii, rather than the t/d difference)
Even if it's not really a vowel length change in Australian English, I'm pretty confident it is in South African English (as spoken by me and many others). Ferry/fairy are distinguished by vowel length only.
It's not the same comparison… but what about the English words "dock" (as in a boat dock) and "talk?" The vowels in them seem subtle different enough.
This one is interesting to me because I can hear (and speak) the difference but it's something I would have never thought of on my own. I think, that the difference here isn't in the vowel `-a-` but more on how the first syllable `rat-(/ratt-)` is stressed in Ratte vs Rathaus.
Bare in mind I'm not a Linguist, but my take on this is that the word Ratte just flows out of my mouth under one breath. The second syllable is is made without needing to "stop my voice" if that makes sense… I just move my tongue up to the top of my mouth to make a small `-t-` sound. Ratte is pronounced very quick.
Rathaus, on the other hand, there is a something like a full stop (but not really a full and total silence) in between `Rat-` and `-Haus`. And for whatever reason, it seems like I pronounce the `-a-` in Rathaus longer than I do in Ratte.
Bare in mind I'm not a Linguist, but my take on this is that the word Ratte just flows out of my mouth under one breath. The second syllable is is made without needing to "stop my voice" if that makes sense… I just move my tongue up to the top of my mouth to make a small `-t-` sound. Ratte is pronounced very quick.
Rathaus, on the other hand, there is a something like a full stop (but not really a full and total silence) in between `Rat-` and `-Haus`. And for whatever reason, it seems like I pronounce the `-a-` in Rathaus longer than I do in Ratte.
Well, by my native language's customs (Finnish), they'd be spelled "Ratte" and "Raathaus", which maybe makes the difference clearer. Same wovel sound, different length.
Sounds the same to me.
https://translate.google.com/#view=home&op=translate&sl=en&t...
https://translate.google.com/#view=home&op=translate&sl=en&t...
Try setting the source language to German instead of English. https://translate.google.com/#view=home&op=translate&sl=de&t...
Likewise, try showing a non-English speaker that "mass" and "mess" are different.
Or better yet: "Luke", "look", and "luck"
And for Spanish speakers there's "Jeep", "sheep" and "cheap"
Or better yet: "Luke", "look", and "luck"
And for Spanish speakers there's "Jeep", "sheep" and "cheap"
By 'non-English speaker' do you mean 'someone with English as a second language', 'someone not speaking English', or 'someone not from England'?
I'm a non-native English speaker, and certainly has no problem distinguishing between your examples; in fact I use such words as illustration when explaining subtleties of Danish pronunciation to anglophones.
And I absolutely cringe whenever '2' is used for 'to', og '4' for 'for'. Just stop it, they sound nothing alike.
I'm a non-native English speaker, and certainly has no problem distinguishing between your examples; in fact I use such words as illustration when explaining subtleties of Danish pronunciation to anglophones.
And I absolutely cringe whenever '2' is used for 'to', og '4' for 'for'. Just stop it, they sound nothing alike.
And I absolutely cringe whenever '2' is used for 'to', og '4' for 'for'. Just stop it, they sound nothing alike.
I'm a native english speaker, and I pronounce those the same.
Two = to = too, but "tool" sometimes nearly has 2 "o" sounds, depending. For = four, and the sound in "four" is not the same as in "foul", which is two sounds.
I'm a native english speaker, and I pronounce those the same.
Two = to = too, but "tool" sometimes nearly has 2 "o" sounds, depending. For = four, and the sound in "four" is not the same as in "foul", which is two sounds.
When I was a kid I found it confusing people would confuse there, their and they're – or rather being taught that people confuse them. I'm not sure whether it was due to me being more literate than verbal or not but "they're" at least has always been distinct to me. Maybe it's due to accent changes. I used to pronounce bull and ball the same.
Bewilders me too. Each has a distinct intonation. Also, the rules aren't really that hard to master.
I learnt that all are pronounced the same: /ðɛː/
What's the concrete difference? Global rising or falling? Upsteps/downsteps? Pitch contours?
What's the concrete difference? Global rising or falling? Upsteps/downsteps? Pitch contours?
> And I absolutely cringe whenever '2' is used for 'to', og '4' for 'for'. Just stop it, they sound nothing alike.
r/iamverysmart
r/iamverysmart
Yeah but I'd still get the puns that exploit the similarity between those words.
As a non native, the double T makes is sound like Rat-te and the single T makes it sound like Raat-aus
If German listening and speaking practice is what you want, give this a try: https://eardoor.com
it's got spaced repetition practice, plus lots of listening material and no sign up required. its free, and there's no annoying app to download.
it's got spaced repetition practice, plus lots of listening material and no sign up required. its free, and there's no annoying app to download.
That site appears to violate the attribution requirements for the recordings they're using. https://tatoeba.org is mentioned in the attribution section, but the individual contributor of each audio file is not identified.
If you don't care about the extra features, you could also just use Tatoeba's own search functionality: https://tatoeba.org/eng/sentences/search?query=&from=deu&to=...
Also works for languages other than German. ( https://tatoeba.org/eng/stats/sentences_by_language )
If you don't care about the extra features, you could also just use Tatoeba's own search functionality: https://tatoeba.org/eng/sentences/search?query=&from=deu&to=...
Also works for languages other than German. ( https://tatoeba.org/eng/stats/sentences_by_language )
"This site has been suspended for copyright violations."
I assume this happened in the last 8 hours or so..
I assume this happened in the last 8 hours or so..
I sent the owner an email asking for attribution to be added. I guess suspending the site is the correct action to take in response to a DMCA complaint, although I'm not sure my email qualifies as one. (It's not infringing my copyright after all.) It appears to have been a useful service for quite a few people, so I hope he puts it back up with the appropriate attribution.
Someone mentioned this in the past few months .. looks useful but I wish there were keyboard shortcuts ..
> many of these videos are from ted talks or speeches by politicians.
I think that's a plus, but it depends on your needs.
I think that's a plus, but it depends on your needs.
Also televangelists. They have an unusual way of enunciating. Reminds me of a road trip with my father through the US. He was listening to an evangelist on the radio and I asked him why. (He's an athiest.) He answered along the lines of "just listen to the beauty of that voice!". He felt the same way about Gospel music. Left an impression.
Long car trips are weird and lonely enough that you can listen to anyone speaking out loud and you just feel a little less lonely no matter what. I think this was the premise of Art Bell's entire career.
My German really isn't up to scratch, but orthograpically/phonetically it is by far the most straightforward and consistent language that I know of. Those compound words may take some time to pick apart, but once you've done, their pronunciation is generally unambiguous.
[deleted]
They have a German version - click on “in English” to get a drop down list of other languages
lol I tried the same :) It is totally ignorant of the context which makes it funny.
I always used forvo.com for this kind of thing.
Edit: It's a "pronunciation dictionary". Ppl just record how they say words and indicate their geography. Super useful for languages like English where there are a lot of regional varieties. And you can contribute too to the dictionary of your language. :)
I'm no affiliated w/ it btw, just really love this website, have been using it for years.
Edit: It's a "pronunciation dictionary". Ppl just record how they say words and indicate their geography. Super useful for languages like English where there are a lot of regional varieties. And you can contribute too to the dictionary of your language. :)
I'm no affiliated w/ it btw, just really love this website, have been using it for years.
Is the American pronunciation of "communal" correct there? https://forvo.com/search/communal/en_usa/
No, this is wrong. It sounds like it's being mispronounced by a native German speaker. There is no hard initial vowel sound; the first syllable is not emphasized like that. There are three syllables in the word: com-mun-al and it's pronounced "kəˈmyo͞on(ə)l,ˈkämyənəl/" so the stress is on the second, not the first syllable.
She does put the stress on the second syllable.
Try rural and epoch
(vs https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/rural and https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/epoch)
(vs https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/rural and https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/epoch)
No, it doesn't even sound like an American.. while the two downvoted ones do sound "correct".
Nope, the other one is right:
https://forvo.com/search/communal/en_other/
Not in my experience.
This is very cool.
I looked up words that have always tripped me up, including banal, brood, indefatigable, preternatural, conch, niche. Indefatigable, banal, and conch had some conflicting ones but the "correct" one occurred enough times that I got the idea. ("Brood" probably isn't commonly mispronounced, I just got it mixed up early in life and never quite got it sorted it out. :)
The results for "niche" are consistently mixed up though, which means that word will continue to drive me insane. Neesh or nitch!? I mix it up when I use it without any rhyme or reason.
I looked up words that have always tripped me up, including banal, brood, indefatigable, preternatural, conch, niche. Indefatigable, banal, and conch had some conflicting ones but the "correct" one occurred enough times that I got the idea. ("Brood" probably isn't commonly mispronounced, I just got it mixed up early in life and never quite got it sorted it out. :)
The results for "niche" are consistently mixed up though, which means that word will continue to drive me insane. Neesh or nitch!? I mix it up when I use it without any rhyme or reason.
Words which are derived or introduced from foreign languages (common in English) can have varying pronunciations. Some people tend to pronounce it close to how it sounds in the original language, others pronounce it with a more native English (be it American, Australian, British, etc.) accent. 'Croissant' 'Chic' 'Bouquet' 'Renaissance' etc.
Then other words which are more native English words (even if they have Latin, Old French, Greek or proto Germanic roots) will have regional variations.
For example 'Tuna' and 'Tuner' can have their pronunciations switched in some parts of the US.
Then other words which are more native English words (even if they have Latin, Old French, Greek or proto Germanic roots) will have regional variations.
For example 'Tuna' and 'Tuner' can have their pronunciations switched in some parts of the US.
I find it interesting that British English speakers are much more likely to pronounce the english sounding version rather than close to how it sounds in the original language.
For example, pretty much across the board I hear "filet" pronounced with the 't' in British English. But Americans almost always a silent 't' like the French.
For example, pretty much across the board I hear "filet" pronounced with the 't' in British English. But Americans almost always a silent 't' like the French.
Your comment led me to check: although there's just a few British persons saying filet, they all pronounce it the "English way", except when it precedes "mignon". Which makes sense, I guess.
The only place I've ever seen filet separated from mignon is McDonald's. Everything else is fillet.
as a brit, I would say 'tuna' and 'tuner' exactly the same
Hearing 'piano \tuna\' and '\tuna\ sandwich' is not odd.
Hearing 'piano \tuna\' and '\tuner\ sandwich' sounds different. It exists.
Hearing 'piano \tuna\' and '\tuner\ sandwich' sounds different. It exists.
If by "it exists", you mean that there are dialects in which those are the pronunciations of "piano tuner" and "tuna sandwich" then I'd like to know more, but I've met many people who speak dialects without the so-called intrusive R and don't understand how it works (but think they do). With intrusive R you get "tuner and mayo" but not "tuner sandwich".
When english results are split in engish it is usually american english vs british english (which is often also spoken in australia and india)
I can't say if that is the case here, but that is what I would suspect. As a british person I have usually heard it and used it as 'neesh'
I can't say if that is the case here, but that is what I would suspect. As a british person I have usually heard it and used it as 'neesh'
It only seems to be some Americans pronounce it nitch, so maybe regional there, though I couldn't guess where or which is most common. Here in the UK essentially always neesh.
It is from French after all.
Edit: American audiobooks on the other hand seem to go 100% with nitch for some unexplainable reason.
It is from French after all.
Edit: American audiobooks on the other hand seem to go 100% with nitch for some unexplainable reason.
> It is from French after all.
This is funny to me because I often see people on the internet mentioning how strange it is that Americans leave off the 'h' when pronouncing 'herb'.
This is funny to me because I often see people on the internet mentioning how strange it is that Americans leave off the 'h' when pronouncing 'herb'.
Kind of weird considering how often British speakers will drop h in other words:
“Allo, allo, what ave we ere,” said the stereotypical constable.
“Allo, allo, what ave we ere,” said the stereotypical constable.
It is fairly unusual for American not to Anglicise pronunciations so it seems to stand as odd one out. Then again you kept the original "correct" pronunciation of herb - it was British English that changed for some reason.
Even the poshest Brit will put the H in herb now.
Even the poshest Brit will put the H in herb now.
> It is fairly unusual for American not to Anglicise pronunciations
Anecdotal, but I think this is only true for French. For example, I think U.S. Americans (even those with no Latin American ethnic background) are much more likely to pronounce Spanish loanwords in a way that's closer to the original than Brits are.
If my anecdotal belief is correct, I suppose it's largely because of the very close contact between the U.K. and France on the one hand, and the U.S. and Latin America on the other.
Anecdotal, but I think this is only true for French. For example, I think U.S. Americans (even those with no Latin American ethnic background) are much more likely to pronounce Spanish loanwords in a way that's closer to the original than Brits are.
If my anecdotal belief is correct, I suppose it's largely because of the very close contact between the U.K. and France on the one hand, and the U.S. and Latin America on the other.
Wait, some people pronounce herb with the 'h' not silent?
British: https://youglish.com/search/herb/uk?
Funnily enough the result I got is completely irrelevant: the sentence is "welcome her back to stage".
The sentence does make sense. Its actually:
"so please welcome Herb Kim back to stage."
"so please welcome Herb Kim back to stage."
Yeah, British people. Not sure about other English speaking nations.
To add to the irony, I have a British accent which often drops (initial) Hs but I cringe whenever I hear 'erbal'.
>It is from French after all.
And yet the British say "filet" with a hard 't'? I have never heard anything but the French pronunciation in the US.
And yet the British say "filet" with a hard 't'? I have never heard anything but the French pronunciation in the US.
I believe BEng distinguishes "fillet" (with a final t) from "filet" (without), the former having been borrowed from French when it still had a /t/ at the end, and the latter being a later re-borrowing (usually in phrases like filet mignon). Something like "filet of fish sandwich" comes across as a humourously fancy name for a pretty ordinary meal.
In mechanical drawing terminology, we pronounce it with a hard "t".
Fillets or rounds are placed features that round off or cap interior or exterior corners or features of a part.
Fillets or rounds are placed features that round off or cap interior or exterior corners or features of a part.
I wonder if our French-Canadian friends to the north might be the reason Americans pronounce it the French way instead of the British way?
It's hard to say "filleted" with the french pronunciation.
it's like being skinned with an epenthetic vowel
That's about 50:50 - probably along regional lines.
According to the Longman Pronunciation Dictionary it is:
niche niːʃ nɪtʃ ǁ nɪtʃ — Preference poll, British English: niːʃ 95%, nɪtʃ 5%. In American English only nɪtʃ.
niche niːʃ nɪtʃ ǁ nɪtʃ — Preference poll, British English: niːʃ 95%, nɪtʃ 5%. In American English only nɪtʃ.
Hrm. American here. I always say "neesh," and I rarely hear "nitch" from other Americans. Wondering whether this is a regional thing.
I’m not familiar with that notation, can you provide some guidance on what those different pronunciations sound like in layman‘s terms?
niːʃ is "neesh". nɪtʃ is "nitch".
However, I'm American, and I anecdotally disagree that "nitch" is the only pronunciation. I exclusively use "neesh" and I regularly hear both pronunciations from other Americans.
However, I'm American, and I anecdotally disagree that "nitch" is the only pronunciation. I exclusively use "neesh" and I regularly hear both pronunciations from other Americans.
[deleted]
When you get inconsistent answers, there might be a deeper reason.
Banal was pronounced like anal, but people got embarassed sometime in the 20th century and started starting saying canal. I like anal.
Variations of indefatigable and preternatural are probably from people who have read it but never heard it pronounced (a. The funny/common example is hyperbole/hyperbolic. It's the stress that is most butchered, which cascades into vowels being pronounced differently. Heurstics in this matter can be internalized and improved.
Niche is one possible outcome of anglicization, which is complex and has different results, mostly depending on how common the word ends up. The more foreign-like (French) is neesh. The more anglicized is nich. Neither are worthy of ridicule (which usually comes from the ignorant, and is another topic altogether). Just avoid mixing the two: Never "neech" (like Nietchze) or "nish", which will make me laugh.
Banal was pronounced like anal, but people got embarassed sometime in the 20th century and started starting saying canal. I like anal.
Variations of indefatigable and preternatural are probably from people who have read it but never heard it pronounced (a. The funny/common example is hyperbole/hyperbolic. It's the stress that is most butchered, which cascades into vowels being pronounced differently. Heurstics in this matter can be internalized and improved.
Niche is one possible outcome of anglicization, which is complex and has different results, mostly depending on how common the word ends up. The more foreign-like (French) is neesh. The more anglicized is nich. Neither are worthy of ridicule (which usually comes from the ignorant, and is another topic altogether). Just avoid mixing the two: Never "neech" (like Nietchze) or "nish", which will make me laugh.
The pronunciation of niche has to do with french not pronouncing ch differently from sh. This is somewhat problematic for french people pronouncing Asian words transliterated in Latin alphabets; they will consistently pronounce ch exactly like sh (« konishiwa », …) (Pikachu is mostly pronounced correctly though.)
GIF is another curiously undecided word. I'm also reminded of "gigawatt", which was widely mispronounced following "Back to the Future" in 1985, but is now generally pronounced correctly. I attribute the change to the introduction of gigabyte hard drives.
"Giga" can be pronounced both ways, AFAIK: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giga-#Pronunciation
Good catch! Among my friends, though, "1.21 jigawatts" is still a funny joke.
>Neesh or nitch!?
I only heard the latter pronunciation fairly recently via a YouTuber, who would say "There are riches in nitches" as a mantra. At first, I put it down to a form of colloquialism and it took me a while to figure out, that he meant 'niches'.
I only heard the latter pronunciation fairly recently via a YouTuber, who would say "There are riches in nitches" as a mantra. At first, I put it down to a form of colloquialism and it took me a while to figure out, that he meant 'niches'.
see also: "clique"
The first four pronounce it like I think it is pronounced then the following five pronounce it as "click" (ignoring mis-subtitled cases of cliché and claque)
It doesn't seem to be consistent in either British or American pronunciations.
The first four pronounce it like I think it is pronounced then the following five pronounce it as "click" (ignoring mis-subtitled cases of cliché and claque)
It doesn't seem to be consistent in either British or American pronunciations.
How would you pronounce it? "Cleek"? I'm American and would pronounce it like "click."
Yes, "cleek"
I was going to say I pronounce it as if it were a French word,
but realistically it's more like I pronounce it as if you were learning high school French as taught in England.
I was going to say I pronounce it as if it were a French word,
but realistically it's more like I pronounce it as if you were learning high school French as taught in England.
> The results for "niche" are consistently mixed up though, which means that word will continue to drive me insane. Neesh or nitch
Pretty sure it comes from French, so "neesh"
Pretty sure it comes from French, so "neesh"
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> Neesh or nitch
I’ve literally only ever heard one person saying nitch. And he was ridiculed for it.
So yeah, for me that pronouncitation seems fairly niche.
I’ve literally only ever heard one person saying nitch. And he was ridiculed for it.
So yeah, for me that pronouncitation seems fairly niche.
Where are you from? I have noticed that U.S. west coast seems to usually say "neesh" but I almost always hear "nitch" in the mid-west and south. Not sure about east coast.
I’m from Europe, consume both US and UK English content and I’ve only ever heard one single youtuber from Wisconsin say “nitch”. That’s it.
So to me it seems most mainstream, non-regional variants of English sticks to the obvious pronunciation.
So to me it seems most mainstream, non-regional variants of English sticks to the obvious pronunciation.
There is no such thing as non-regional variants of English.
And YouTube is not going to give you a very diverse sampling of English pronunciation.
Content creators for YouTube are heavily, heavily coastal. Mostly west coast.
And YouTube is not going to give you a very diverse sampling of English pronunciation.
Content creators for YouTube are heavily, heavily coastal. Mostly west coast.
Awesome site! This is infinitely more useful than any other pronunciation site I've seen.
Two questions:
I'm guessing the site uses the YouTube API to build a database from video captions, but which videos does it pull from? All of them or a subset? Querying the word "the" yields about 12 million results which seems low to me.
Also, is there any way to prevent the site from modifying my YouTube watch history? I noticed after clicking around a few times and then going back to YouTube's home page that my recommendations had been updated based on the random videos I'd been fed. Clearly this isn't desirable behavior, but I don't know if there's any way around it. For the time being for other users, I recommend using an incognito or private window.
Two questions:
I'm guessing the site uses the YouTube API to build a database from video captions, but which videos does it pull from? All of them or a subset? Querying the word "the" yields about 12 million results which seems low to me.
Also, is there any way to prevent the site from modifying my YouTube watch history? I noticed after clicking around a few times and then going back to YouTube's home page that my recommendations had been updated based on the random videos I'd been fed. Clearly this isn't desirable behavior, but I don't know if there's any way around it. For the time being for other users, I recommend using an incognito or private window.
> my recommendations had been updated based on the random videos I'd been fed. Clearly this isn't desirable behavior
Oh, it very much is desirable behaviour for me, I see it as an opportunity to get out of my filter bubble and remember YouTube's content variety. Especially given that the videos here are constrained to be from the UK, having captions and hence likely not "funny viral clips" or random vlogs.
Oh, it very much is desirable behaviour for me, I see it as an opportunity to get out of my filter bubble and remember YouTube's content variety. Especially given that the videos here are constrained to be from the UK, having captions and hence likely not "funny viral clips" or random vlogs.
As a user, open the page in a private window.
Finally, a way to learn how to pronounce such important conversational phrases as "jet fuel can't melt steel beams" and "Google flat Earth."
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8 pronunciations of supercalifragilisticexpialidocious in English: https://youglish.com/search/supercalifragilisticexpialidocio...
Best result: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2467&v=4axGm0g-1...
Best result: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2467&v=4axGm0g-1...
One clip was so intriguing, I had to go back and watch the whole thing, and it was really good:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2Za1TlYvBc
I'm a native English speaker but this could actually be a very cool discovery tool. I typed in my own (relatively rare) last name and found cool graduations and community organization videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2Za1TlYvBc
I'm a native English speaker but this could actually be a very cool discovery tool. I typed in my own (relatively rare) last name and found cool graduations and community organization videos.
That led me on a 30 minute divergence, thanks :)
This is also an amazing tool for anyone making electronic music that is looking for samples! I've been looking for something like this for quite some time: a tool to find audio clips on YouTube that match a particular phrase. Nothing like "lose your mind, get out of control" [1] to enhance a techno track!
1. https://youglish.com/search/lose%20your%20mind/all
1. https://youglish.com/search/lose%20your%20mind/all
Don't want to rain on your parade, but the next passage comes straight out of their TOS:
User acknowledges sole responsibility for obtaining required licenses. YOUGLISH.COM grants you permission to display, copy, distribute and download the Materials on this Site provided that: (1) both the copyright notice identified below and this permission notice appear in the Materials; (2) the use of such Materials is solely for personal, non-commercial use; and (3) the Materials are not modified in any way.
User acknowledges sole responsibility for obtaining required licenses. YOUGLISH.COM grants you permission to display, copy, distribute and download the Materials on this Site provided that: (1) both the copyright notice identified below and this permission notice appear in the Materials; (2) the use of such Materials is solely for personal, non-commercial use; and (3) the Materials are not modified in any way.
These are YouTube videos. I don't think the Youglish TOS has any sway over them. Besides, I'd rely on the fair use doctrine, which I think applies in this case.
How do you leave feedback for what is just a bad pronunciation? The options I can see are:
This is not english!
Wrong caption?
Wrong accent?
Poor sound quality.
Poor video quality.
Crude/shocking content.
I don't think any of those fit what I'm hearing for https://youglish.com/getcid/3905773/coxswain
Wrong caption?
Wrong accent?
Poor sound quality.
Poor video quality.
Crude/shocking content.
I don't think any of those fit what I'm hearing for https://youglish.com/getcid/3905773/coxswain
I agree there's an issue; "mispronounced" should be one of the feedback options. The third video for "especially" pronounces the word as "ekspecially".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=478&v=Td2hfdXQ5x...
Love the site, though! Great work.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=478&v=Td2hfdXQ5x...
Love the site, though! Great work.
I would also like to see a feedback option for wrong word (same spelling). For example I searched for "melee" meaning (close to) "chaotic fight", and one of the entries referred to a person called "MeLee". It should be possible to flag this and either automatically or manually review the entry.
Maybe the idea is to be strictly descriptivist? The way people actually pronounce the word _is_ the correct way. That's why you can listen to multiple examples and see what the common pronunciation is.
This is amazing, not only for learning english but also for quickly finding videos of a subject you are interested in (which is quicker than YouTube search as this is almost a "Feeling lucky" search).
Exactly! This is amazing. I can search for esoteric words/ideas like "soulcraft" and instantly find a niche of interesting videos etc. to further my ideas. This is a gamechanger.
Interesting. I found one problem, though. (Or is it a feature?)
All examples I listened to of "coup de grâce" pronounced it /ku də ɡrɑː/, while the "correct" way (if there is such a thing)is /ku də ɡrɑs/.
This kind of thing must come up in more examples. I'm not usually on the prescriptive side of things, but I think it's important to know the "right" way to do things, at least when you're learning a language. On the other hand, hypercorrection will probably never disappear, so why not embrace it?
All examples I listened to of "coup de grâce" pronounced it /ku də ɡrɑː/, while the "correct" way (if there is such a thing)is /ku də ɡrɑs/.
This kind of thing must come up in more examples. I'm not usually on the prescriptive side of things, but I think it's important to know the "right" way to do things, at least when you're learning a language. On the other hand, hypercorrection will probably never disappear, so why not embrace it?
> coup de grâce
"Funny" that they have a french word and a french statement as the second and third example. But maybe not and it is intentionally, 'whois' says Registrant Country is FR. In any case, very cool and works impressively AFAICS. Wonder how long it will stay up until our Google overlords sends a cease and desist
"Funny" that they have a french word and a french statement as the second and third example. But maybe not and it is intentionally, 'whois' says Registrant Country is FR. In any case, very cool and works impressively AFAICS. Wonder how long it will stay up until our Google overlords sends a cease and desist
“Coup de grace” caught my attention as well. It showed a speaker with a very notable RP pronouncing this phase with a very fake sounding French ‘r’ and no ‘s’ in the end, when the s sound is clearly present in the French and modern English pronunciation. Some might say that he butchered it.
I agree with embracing hypercorrection (or at least, not getting upset about it), but it's also worth accepting that mispronounced loanwords can never really 'win' while the original language still exists, so there will always be a tension. 75m native French speakers will always win any argument about how to pronounce "grâce".
Off-topic, but looking up "/ku də ɡrɑː/" on Google now brings up this thread as one of the top results due to your comment. This comment of mine will only make it worse.
If you want to learn to speak english well, watch those programs that use English properly. Blackadder. Archer. Sherlock. Even some of the marvel movies (GOTG) are very careful in how they pronounce and articulate words. Then watch every Brian Cox and Attenborough documentary. You might come out with a bit of a British accent but that is far far better than any youtube-derived accent. Better you sound like Stirling Archer than [insert random youtube person].
So you're equating using English "properly" with British (specifically, English) English? From a linguistic point of view, you couldn't be more wrong.
No variety of any language is superior to another
No variety of any language is superior to another
Not variety or accent. These shows use words carefully. They speak in exact meanings. The use a wider vocabulary and do not blur words. In fact much of their humor is based on misunderstandings rooted in pronunciation. Archer makes jokes about furriers and farriers. Blackadder about the formal name "Captain Darling" and the pet name "my darling", forcing the listener to maintain an understanding of context. These tricks aren't used on The Simpsons or the Big Bang Theory, shows largely aimed at lowest common denominators. Such differences are irrespective of accent or dialect.
For starters one of them - Archer - is American, not British. And nobody is saying one language is better than the other, but certainly with these programs you won't pick up bad habits like using "hence why" or confusing "than" and "then" (which I see ALL the time here on HN).
It's not even a UK vs USA thing - for me (a Scot) I notice that large parts of southern England have appalling pronunciation ("fing" vs "thing", "bovver" instead of "bother", pronouncing "r" like "w" - see how the guy on the right pronounces "presentation" as "pwesentation", and "Ryzen" like "Wyzen" here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lP2QkBnRqko), and that's the most populous region so much of our TV would also be no-go for English learners.
It's not even a UK vs USA thing - for me (a Scot) I notice that large parts of southern England have appalling pronunciation ("fing" vs "thing", "bovver" instead of "bother", pronouncing "r" like "w" - see how the guy on the right pronounces "presentation" as "pwesentation", and "Ryzen" like "Wyzen" here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lP2QkBnRqko), and that's the most populous region so much of our TV would also be no-go for English learners.
You are just attaching prestige to some variants of the language over others. It just so happens that variants of English spoken by professional classes in the SE of England or NE USA are more prestigious (at least for some) than variants of English in a pub in Liverpool or Glasgow, but those other variants are not "wrong" and don't have "appalling pronunciation", they just have different pronunciation.
If there was a revolution and the residents of liverpool became the new ruling classes then pretty quickly that would be the "correct" variant and the queen's English would be the "appalling pronunciation".
If there was a revolution and the residents of liverpool became the new ruling classes then pretty quickly that would be the "correct" variant and the queen's English would be the "appalling pronunciation".
>> You are just attaching prestige to some variants of the language over others.
Yes. This is about people wanting to improve their english. They have identified that their english is less than they deem acceptable. If you want to improve, you need something to aim for. So that does indeed mean putting one version over another.
Yes. This is about people wanting to improve their english. They have identified that their english is less than they deem acceptable. If you want to improve, you need something to aim for. So that does indeed mean putting one version over another.
I'm not sure if you read my comment right, it seems you have understood it exactly the wrong way round. I'm Scottish, saying that contrary to popular belief it is actually the south of England who make the most bizarre pronunciation choices in the UK
The guy in the video I linked is actually an excellent example of the "professional class", and should by conventional wisdom be the kind of pronunciation you should aim for ... but you'd be entirely wrong to do so.
The guy in the video I linked is actually an excellent example of the "professional class", and should by conventional wisdom be the kind of pronunciation you should aim for ... but you'd be entirely wrong to do so.
Every word in the English language is a poorly pronounced version of some older word that preceded it. What makes some words as pronounced in the south of England bizarre or wrong?
Well the whole point of this is that someone was suggesting examples of good English, someone balked at the idea that British English should be considered "proper" and I suggested that this wasn't the intended point point and added that even supposedly highly regarded accents of British English might not be considered proper by someone from that same country. I don't think it's helpful in this context to shrug your shoulders and say that English is evolving so there's no good or bad examples of pronunciation.
As to why these sound wrong to me, I'm from an area that is looked down on accent-wise and is sort of the subject of ridicule (usually just for fun). Since I moved abroad and mix in pretty multi-cultural circles I've seen first-hand what non-native-English speakers have trouble understanding when they talk to an English-native speaker, and I've often reflected on what caused this. One thing that surprised me was how easily my fellow Scots have been understood and how much difficulty people had understanding the English, since I was always led to believe that we are the ones who talk incorrectly. And it was this that made me realise how their pronunciation can stray far from the supposedly correct one - I gave a couple of examples to demonstrate this. There are plenty more if you listen carefully. The "how do you pronounce..." part of the NY Times British & Irish accent quiz was really quite good at illustrating this: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/02/15/upshot/britis... (door/poor, farm/palm, horse/hoarse from there are nice examples).
So yeh sure, nothing is "wrong" in English and all that - there's no central authority that should dictate this. But when it comes to accents and clarity not all is as it might seem at first blush.
As to why these sound wrong to me, I'm from an area that is looked down on accent-wise and is sort of the subject of ridicule (usually just for fun). Since I moved abroad and mix in pretty multi-cultural circles I've seen first-hand what non-native-English speakers have trouble understanding when they talk to an English-native speaker, and I've often reflected on what caused this. One thing that surprised me was how easily my fellow Scots have been understood and how much difficulty people had understanding the English, since I was always led to believe that we are the ones who talk incorrectly. And it was this that made me realise how their pronunciation can stray far from the supposedly correct one - I gave a couple of examples to demonstrate this. There are plenty more if you listen carefully. The "how do you pronounce..." part of the NY Times British & Irish accent quiz was really quite good at illustrating this: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/02/15/upshot/britis... (door/poor, farm/palm, horse/hoarse from there are nice examples).
So yeh sure, nothing is "wrong" in English and all that - there's no central authority that should dictate this. But when it comes to accents and clarity not all is as it might seem at first blush.
Agreed. I grew up watching "Yes Prime Minister" and anything Monty Python in Norway. Has served me well in Australia.
Further to this, I've also worked on my diction using a number of available resources such as https://www.audible.com.au/search?keywords=get+rid+of+your+a... .
I could never fully appropriate the Australian accent, but something more akin to British becomes non-determinate and easier on the ear (ref: how people prefer speech synthesis in a different English region to their own).
It kind of surprises me that more non-native English speakers don't do the same; I have worked with people who I've really struggled to understand. But I can't really tell them "can you please work on your accent", as much as I wish I could and I knew it would serve them well.
Further to this, I've also worked on my diction using a number of available resources such as https://www.audible.com.au/search?keywords=get+rid+of+your+a... .
I could never fully appropriate the Australian accent, but something more akin to British becomes non-determinate and easier on the ear (ref: how people prefer speech synthesis in a different English region to their own).
It kind of surprises me that more non-native English speakers don't do the same; I have worked with people who I've really struggled to understand. But I can't really tell them "can you please work on your accent", as much as I wish I could and I knew it would serve them well.
A bit of Fry and Laurie, on language:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MWpHQQ-wQg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MWpHQQ-wQg
So you would also recommend watching Archer and H. Jon Benjamin animated series? (Bob's Burgers) I'd certainly recommend them though I'm not sure he's a canonical example of the language.
By watching Archer you might also perhaps, better understand when things are phrased inappropriately?
By watching Archer you might also perhaps, better understand when things are phrased inappropriately?
He isn't. The archer writers are. The Bobs Burger's writers are not. It isn't about sound or accent. It is about language. Bob will slur his words slight, and uses are much lower vocabulary. Archer does the opposite. The actor is a small part of that distinction.
I found out about this tool just 3 days ago and now I see it on the front page of HN.
I was trying to embed an audio version of my name's pronunciation on my blog, since, most people find it hard to pronounce my name. I googled a bit to see if there is any tool that would do it and stumbled upon this lovely app. I was amazed by the idea and accuracy of this app. It works well for the use case it was designed for. Unfortunately, mine was different.
I was trying to embed an audio version of my name's pronunciation on my blog, since, most people find it hard to pronounce my name. I googled a bit to see if there is any tool that would do it and stumbled upon this lovely app. I was amazed by the idea and accuracy of this app. It works well for the use case it was designed for. Unfortunately, mine was different.
Does this site violate YouTube's terms of service for putting banner ads/advertising on the same pages as the YT embedded videos?
I'm not actually sure how I feel about this. Australian English is distinct, and one of its key features is heavy use of shortened words and dropped letters. For example, the word "going" becomes "goin".
My intuition (and complete guess) is that ML is pretty far away from distinguishing slang words. Maybe it can understand it, at least to some extent, but categorizing it by country (well you really even need region) is harder.
I'm Australian, and I would never recommend that someone learn English by listening to one of my countrymen. We are lazy, nasal, slurred speakers. Standard English or American are much more preferable.
You chose an example that is ubiquitous in USA, like "gonna".
You can choose between US, UK and AUS.
https://youglish.com/search/tuple/all?
Roughly 60 / 40 short u ('tupple') vs long u ('toople').
Roughly 60 / 40 short u ('tupple') vs long u ('toople').
It's like gif (ghif) vs gif (jif)... even among native speakers it will be heavily polarized
Is the short u 'tupple' wrong despite it's popularity because if so I've been lying to people...
It's not. Not even when used as a suffix in 'real' words.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/quintuple
In thinking about this, I realized I say short quintuple but long standalone tuple. I can probably retcon myself some reason but I don't think there is any.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/quintuple
In thinking about this, I realized I say short quintuple but long standalone tuple. I can probably retcon myself some reason but I don't think there is any.
All right everyone! We're ALL wrong! GIF is pronounced: https://youglish.com/search/gif/all
I don't know if different people see different video queues, but I had 2 subsequent videos of the same person pronouncing GIF as `GIFF` and `JYFE` :-/
Weird, the one I've see spells it out. But they aren't intending to say the image format.
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Am I the only one that uses Google Translate "listen" option for learning pronunciation of weird words?
I recommend forvo.com (like another commenter mentioned), as GT doesn't work that great for certain languages (ex. Catalan is just a robotic voice).
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I'm going to rant here... I hate the way some people seem to think that a recording is a good way of explaining the pronunciation of an English word. In my (bigoted) opinion the only good way to explain the pronunciation of an English word is with a phonemic transcription into IPA. This is because even within England there are are lots of different pronunciations of the same sound. What you want (or at least I want) to know is whether the first vowel in "Malcow", say, is the same as the vowel in "hawk" or the vowel in "trap". A recording of a particular person saying just the word "Malcow" doesn't necessarily give you that information, and certainly not in an accessible way.
(Also, a lesser consideration: there are some native speakers of English who can distinguish certain sounds in their pronunciation but cannot, or cannot easily, hear the difference between those sounds. I would guess that either they learnt to speak partly by watching people's lips or their hearing has deteriorated as they got older.)
None of the above is specific to English. If I wanted to know how a French word is pronounced I'd prefer IPA to a recording just the same, if not more so.
Admittedly not everyone loves IPA like I do (perhaps some people think it's a kind of beer). The online Oxford English Dictionary provides IPA transcriptions of both the British and American pronunciations and you can click on them to hear a recording. Perfect.
(Also, a lesser consideration: there are some native speakers of English who can distinguish certain sounds in their pronunciation but cannot, or cannot easily, hear the difference between those sounds. I would guess that either they learnt to speak partly by watching people's lips or their hearing has deteriorated as they got older.)
None of the above is specific to English. If I wanted to know how a French word is pronounced I'd prefer IPA to a recording just the same, if not more so.
Admittedly not everyone loves IPA like I do (perhaps some people think it's a kind of beer). The online Oxford English Dictionary provides IPA transcriptions of both the British and American pronunciations and you can click on them to hear a recording. Perfect.
As Daniel Jones wrote in his The Pronunciation of English (I am paraphrasing from the 1962 edition, because I do not have it at hand), it is impossible to learn the sounds of English from phonemic transcriptions alone; you need a living teacher, or, in absense of them, good recordings of representative sounds (he went on to reference certain good-quality authoritative recordings of the time). Youtube can be regarded as one source of such recordings.
Yes. There are two different things here:
* Learning how to pronounce the sounds of English: for example, how to pronounce (standard) English /a/, which is, of course, different from (standard) German /a/.
* Learning which sounds to use in a particular word: for example, is "swap" pronounced /swap/? (It isn't, of course. In practice most of the difficulties are caused by names of people and places.)
* Learning how to pronounce the sounds of English: for example, how to pronounce (standard) English /a/, which is, of course, different from (standard) German /a/.
* Learning which sounds to use in a particular word: for example, is "swap" pronounced /swap/? (It isn't, of course. In practice most of the difficulties are caused by names of people and places.)
A recording is a good, though, in the same way as hearing native people speak improves your own pronunciation over time.
This even happens without you realizing it.
If I really can't get a word down through pronunciation, it honestly helps to see it typed out phonetically in English.
For example, "Hygiene" is spelled the same in both english and Norwegian, but pronunciation differs.
So while in english we might say, "Hi-Gene", in Norwegian I say "Hee-gee-inne". It doesn't work for all words, especially with vowels and sounds that aren't in english.
Had I only had IPA symbols, that takes even longer because of the time it takes to learn the symbolism. I think if it were truly a better way to learn, it would be taught to new immigrants instead of the immersive adult learning that I had, which focused vocabulary on repeating sounds and lots of listening, and the very occasional visual aide to know how to shape our mouth and where to put our tongues.
Not that my pronunciation is perfect, mind you, but I'm passable even if I retain a strong English accent when I speak Norwegian. Most of the time, I'm understandable and the spouse is nice enough to point out rough spots if I slip up too much.
This even happens without you realizing it.
If I really can't get a word down through pronunciation, it honestly helps to see it typed out phonetically in English.
For example, "Hygiene" is spelled the same in both english and Norwegian, but pronunciation differs.
So while in english we might say, "Hi-Gene", in Norwegian I say "Hee-gee-inne". It doesn't work for all words, especially with vowels and sounds that aren't in english.
Had I only had IPA symbols, that takes even longer because of the time it takes to learn the symbolism. I think if it were truly a better way to learn, it would be taught to new immigrants instead of the immersive adult learning that I had, which focused vocabulary on repeating sounds and lots of listening, and the very occasional visual aide to know how to shape our mouth and where to put our tongues.
Not that my pronunciation is perfect, mind you, but I'm passable even if I retain a strong English accent when I speak Norwegian. Most of the time, I'm understandable and the spouse is nice enough to point out rough spots if I slip up too much.
> (Also, a lesser consideration: there are some native speakers of English who can distinguish certain sounds in their pronunciation but cannot, or cannot easily, hear the difference between those sounds. I would guess that either they learnt to speak partly by watching people's lips or their hearing has deteriorated as they got older.)
It may also be down to the conceptual buckets into which we place sounds when learning languages, especially our native languages. For example, many English speakers would be surprised to learn that 'p' has two distinct pronunciations in English, aspirated (as in 'pin') and unaspirated (as in 'spin'). Similarly, the 'l' at the start of 'late' is not the same as that at the end of 'wool', the so-called 'dark l' sound. (Caveat: IIRC, some varieties of English do not make the latter distinction, and I wouldn't be surprised if some don't make the former one, either.)
A couple of personal anecdotes:
- I have a friend who pronounces the word "hook" with a long "oo" sound, whereas I pronounce it with a much shorter vowel (we have very different regional accents). When I pointed this out to him, he could not at first tell the difference between our pronunciations. It was only when I compared it to the difference between "pull" and "pool" -- which he did pronounce slightly differently -- that he grudgingly acknowledged the distinction.
- A Northern Irish colleague expressed incredulity at the southern English habit of pronouncing "poor", "paw" and "pour" the same, when in his part of the world they were, to his ears, said quite differently. When he spoke those words, I could hear that difference too -- but only just, and it took concentration.
It may also be down to the conceptual buckets into which we place sounds when learning languages, especially our native languages. For example, many English speakers would be surprised to learn that 'p' has two distinct pronunciations in English, aspirated (as in 'pin') and unaspirated (as in 'spin'). Similarly, the 'l' at the start of 'late' is not the same as that at the end of 'wool', the so-called 'dark l' sound. (Caveat: IIRC, some varieties of English do not make the latter distinction, and I wouldn't be surprised if some don't make the former one, either.)
A couple of personal anecdotes:
- I have a friend who pronounces the word "hook" with a long "oo" sound, whereas I pronounce it with a much shorter vowel (we have very different regional accents). When I pointed this out to him, he could not at first tell the difference between our pronunciations. It was only when I compared it to the difference between "pull" and "pool" -- which he did pronounce slightly differently -- that he grudgingly acknowledged the distinction.
- A Northern Irish colleague expressed incredulity at the southern English habit of pronouncing "poor", "paw" and "pour" the same, when in his part of the world they were, to his ears, said quite differently. When he spoke those words, I could hear that difference too -- but only just, and it took concentration.
Seem to think?
hear and repeat is pretty much how we all acquired our mother tongues. IPA is nice in the absence of a tutor, or a native speaker, but it's definitely not superior.
Forgetting the fact people need to be trained in understanding how to interpret IPA before they can even use it, it still misses some subtle inflections.
hear and repeat is pretty much how we all acquired our mother tongues. IPA is nice in the absence of a tutor, or a native speaker, but it's definitely not superior.
Forgetting the fact people need to be trained in understanding how to interpret IPA before they can even use it, it still misses some subtle inflections.
I'm not sure I understand. A single word may have many different IPA transcriptions for different regional accents, so IPA won't necessarily tell you what you want to know.
Several commenters in this thread missed the language drop down.
In addition to being rather small, the drop down has an awful color contrast ratio of 2.75 : 1 between the dark grey text (#7f98ad) and the light grey background (#f5f5f5)[1]. Have you considered making this page more accessible?
[1] https://dequeuniversity.com/rules/axe/2.5/color-contrast
In addition to being rather small, the drop down has an awful color contrast ratio of 2.75 : 1 between the dark grey text (#7f98ad) and the light grey background (#f5f5f5)[1]. Have you considered making this page more accessible?
[1] https://dequeuniversity.com/rules/axe/2.5/color-contrast
Apparently every English student in China learns the following exchange:
How are you doing today? /
I'm fine, thank you, and you?
I've had trouble explaining why this is a weirdly formal response that native speakers would probably never use. So it was somewhat amusing to find zero search results for this! (not counting partial matches). It seems like the first phrases you learn in any foreign language reliably turn out to be phrases nobody actually uses.
I've had trouble explaining why this is a weirdly formal response that native speakers would probably never use. So it was somewhat amusing to find zero search results for this! (not counting partial matches). It seems like the first phrases you learn in any foreign language reliably turn out to be phrases nobody actually uses.
Every English student in Germany too. At least it was like that when I learned English in school.
This seems to be so common that there are even a bunch of Youtube videos out there about this topic, for example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_53mo10_Mbk
This seems to be so common that there are even a bunch of Youtube videos out there about this topic, for example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_53mo10_Mbk
I remember many years ago in Spain the most used book to learn English the first sentences were pretty much those and in one of the first lessons there was a sentence that became widely known: "My taylor is rich", it was synonym with studying English.
I guess they would only use English in formal situations like when you go to shops etc. in those cases that is a normal exchange in UK english
Can you elaborate a bit on why it's a weird response? What would be more appropriate? Non-native speaker here
It’s quite formal and ritualised in a language whose premier cultural exporter has been quite outwardly egalitarian since at least WWII.
It’s just old fashioned. If you’re on this forum you’ve read enough English you’re unlikely to mess up but
How are you?
Great thanks. You?
Fine, fine.
It’s scripted insofar as no one cares how the other person actually is and answering I anything other than a positive fashion would be a faux pas but everything after “How are you?” is fluid. You can also go even less formal, e.g. “How’s it going?”
It’s just old fashioned. If you’re on this forum you’ve read enough English you’re unlikely to mess up but
How are you?
Great thanks. You?
Fine, fine.
It’s scripted insofar as no one cares how the other person actually is and answering I anything other than a positive fashion would be a faux pas but everything after “How are you?” is fluid. You can also go even less formal, e.g. “How’s it going?”
"I'm fine, how are you?" or "I'm fine, what about you?" would both be more normal in my opinion.
I searched for "Swap" because my co-worker used to say "swa app".
https://youglish.com/search/swap/all
https://youtu.be/vJSk4RR2QO4?t=313
This video comes back, and he actually says 'swat'...
https://youglish.com/search/swap/all
https://youtu.be/vJSk4RR2QO4?t=313
This video comes back, and he actually says 'swat'...
hehe, I had to try the words I know are pronounced wrong. "Paella" it's pronounced paeya, not payeya. Also half the population says ecsetera instead of etcetera
Only about 1 in 8 speakers uses incorrect "excetera" pronunciation:
https://youglish.com/search/%22et%20cetera%22/all?
Even 12% -- is far too many for my taste. But at least I can use "et cetera" pronunciation as a quick "literacy level" test.
https://youglish.com/search/%22et%20cetera%22/all?
Even 12% -- is far too many for my taste. But at least I can use "et cetera" pronunciation as a quick "literacy level" test.
It's an extremely common deformation I think, "excetera" is also a very common pronunciation in French. I really doubt it's heavily tied to literacy level at any level, it's probably more comfortable to pronounce.
Remember that basically every word of your language (regardless of the language) was probably at some point considered some low-class corruption of the "proper" language.
When it comes to English in particular look at the mess that's English spelling and the massive phonetic shifts it underwent during the past centuries, it seems a bit silly to single out "excetera" as the one bad pronunciation used by illiterate people.
Remember that basically every word of your language (regardless of the language) was probably at some point considered some low-class corruption of the "proper" language.
When it comes to English in particular look at the mess that's English spelling and the massive phonetic shifts it underwent during the past centuries, it seems a bit silly to single out "excetera" as the one bad pronunciation used by illiterate people.
> "excetera" is also a very common pronunciation in French.
Not in my experience. Where are you from?
Not in my experience. Where are you from?
Try "February", and cringe....
> "Here are 4 tips that should help you perfect your pronunciation of 'February':
> Break 'February' down into sounds: [FEB] + [YUH] + [REE] ..."
Ugh!
> "Here are 4 tips that should help you perfect your pronunciation of 'February':
> Break 'February' down into sounds: [FEB] + [YUH] + [REE] ..."
Ugh!
It's interesting you didn't take the opportunity to notice it as an interesting word, that has many subtle nuances by native speakers.
But instead saw it as a reinforcement, that solely you have the exact right way to pronounce the word.
But instead saw it as a reinforcement, that solely you have the exact right way to pronounce the word.
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I hope that some YouTube publishers start using this. It's always jarring when some tech vlogger puts up a video with blatant mispronunciations.
Sometimes it can be attributed to regionalisms (8-Bit Guy uses Texas-isms in addition to his usual set of mispronunciations). Sometimes it's just not paying attention, like one video game blogger who mispronounced "Imagic," showed an old Imagic TV commercial where the name was pronounced correctly, and then mispronounced "Imagic" immediately after. But some simply aren't bothering to look up the correct pronunciation of things.
/Former broadcaster, trained in pronunciation, and in correcting the pronunciation of TV news anchors.
Sometimes it can be attributed to regionalisms (8-Bit Guy uses Texas-isms in addition to his usual set of mispronunciations). Sometimes it's just not paying attention, like one video game blogger who mispronounced "Imagic," showed an old Imagic TV commercial where the name was pronounced correctly, and then mispronounced "Imagic" immediately after. But some simply aren't bothering to look up the correct pronunciation of things.
/Former broadcaster, trained in pronunciation, and in correcting the pronunciation of TV news anchors.
Some other guy being so nasal he can't pronounce monsters and it comes out as bonsters.
I like that this website offers a variety of pronunciations for each word. A lot of websites people use for pronunciations will provide a single pronunciation they deem to be correct, whereas there are multiple pronunciations in actual use.
https://youglish.com/search/raison%20d%27%C3%AAtre/all
Not exactly English, but it's in the dictionary. I don't know if I should be impressed that the first result actually sounded pretty reasonable or disappointed at how bad some of these pronunciations are.
Of course, the whole thing is gonna be "results may vary", I suppose... https://youglish.com/getcid/25032799/electrophoresis
Not exactly English, but it's in the dictionary. I don't know if I should be impressed that the first result actually sounded pretty reasonable or disappointed at how bad some of these pronunciations are.
Of course, the whole thing is gonna be "results may vary", I suppose... https://youglish.com/getcid/25032799/electrophoresis
If it's in the dictionary it is English. Or do we start throwing out everything we got from Norman French too?
https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/raison%20d'etre
https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/raison%20d'etre
I wonder if language pronunciation will drift less over time, given the technology to record the spoken word and play it back at a much later day? Any linguists on HN thinking about vowel drift in the digital age?
I also wonder if technology could have the opposite effect of expediting the adoption of “new” pronunciations only among certain demographics. It’s not linguistics (or maybe it is?) but the number of 20-something women speaking with vocal fry seems to have increased thanks to pop culture/the Kardashians.
Here's a good one:
https://youglish.com/search/triskaidekaphobia/all
Every person pronounces it differently.
https://youglish.com/search/triskaidekaphobia/all
Every person pronounces it differently.
These people pronouncing just that word pronounce it the same: https://forvo.com/word/triskaidekaphobia/#en
Listen again. The British one pronounces "ai" differently, and the American ones put emphasis on different syllables.
Sounds cool! Funny thing : the first thing I was greeted with was "How to pronounce coup de grâce in English (1 out of 23)". Being French, I do find that a little hard to swallow :D
The word biopic comes from “biographical picture” and shouldn’t rhyme with myopic. I only learned this recently. But, alas, on a website for correct pronunciation...
https://youglish.com/search/Biopic/all?
Here’s forvo, for contrast:
https://forvo.com/word/biopic/
https://youglish.com/search/Biopic/all?
Here’s forvo, for contrast:
https://forvo.com/word/biopic/
Wow.. This is amazing. As someone who mispronounces lot of words because of my education in Indian English which takes most of the sounds from British English, this is very helpful. Though there are google and merriam websters dictionary, sometimes it is not easy to get the pronunciation in a sentence. This fills that gap! I'm also curious know how it is implemented. Thanks & all the best!
Google Dictionary (that one you get while querying "define word") has nice collection of record samples from native speakers (unlike Google Translate where samples are synthetized). I like to compare British and American accents. (Let's say I use two browsers with distinct language preferences.) Some US samples are performed by lady with unbelievably charming voice.
I've always struggled with the pronunciation of the word "route" and this doesn't seem to help. Try:
https://youglish.com/search/route/us
vs
https://youglish.com/search/route/uk
https://youglish.com/search/route/us
vs
https://youglish.com/search/route/uk
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I tried to find the American English pronunciation for 'agile', thinking it would be the same as in 'fragile' (silent i and e at the end), but for all examples, the 'i' is pronounced like in 'isle'. Can anyone chime in with the correct AE pronunciation?
My English Dictionary corresponds to what i expected, but it is different in practice it seems.
My English Dictionary corresponds to what i expected, but it is different in practice it seems.
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If this works for names I'm going to try to win a 30 year old bet with "Raistlin Majere"
I can't stop playing with this. Plugging in foreign words and locations is pretty fun, like Nouakchott, N'Djamena, Lviv, Hagia Sophia, Ibiza, Louvre, etc. Just getting the variety of organic, candid pronunciations is fascinating.
One of the harder things with English pronunciation I found was to be able to correctly vocalise "warm" and "worm", "crap" and "crepe" and similar. Think a resource like this would have helped.
Really cool site, I can see myself using this extensively for learning German. One cool "feature" is that I get to see videos on various topics that I wouldn't normally search for. Invaluable for training the ear.
Unless you want to know how to say "Notre Dame".
https://youglish.com/search/notre%20dame/all?
https://youglish.com/search/notre%20dame/all?
If you're talking about the University of Notre Dame in Indiana USA, the most common pronunciation is /noʊtrəˈdeɪm/ or /noʊtərˈdeɪm/ (NOH-tər-DAYM). Simon Whistler's video uses both the American and French versions appropriately:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKhPDprqB_c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKhPDprqB_c
You can switch to French.
https://translate.google.com/#en/ has this feature too. Its pronunciation is perfect most of the time.
I tried Youtube, but only learned to meow and play 80's song on piano.
It works well with the two words "segue" and "awry" as native 50+ year old Aussie English speaker that I only connected the spelling and pronunciation in the last 10 years or so.
Very nice tool.
I've been replaying every Whatsapp/Signal/Messenger voice message I send to listen to how I speak, and it has helped me quite a bit with enunciatng.
This will be a welcome addition to my grammartoire.
I've been replaying every Whatsapp/Signal/Messenger voice message I send to listen to how I speak, and it has helped me quite a bit with enunciatng.
This will be a welcome addition to my grammartoire.
the website name doesn't make it obvious, but they support 7 languages.
There's a little dropdown on the right of the big "Youglish" logo.
I tried it in Italian (my native language) and it works extremely well.
There's a little dropdown on the right of the big "Youglish" logo.
I tried it in Italian (my native language) and it works extremely well.
I will use this a LOT. This is the website I always wanted to have! I've tested different words and its quite accurate.
I would suggest having the auto-completion for words just like Google search.
I would suggest having the auto-completion for words just like Google search.
This is really helpful even for speakers of English since there are so many ways to pronounce the same word between countries and even within a country.
For example, try comparing UK and US pronunciation of these words:
- herbs
- route
- privacy
For example, try comparing UK and US pronunciation of these words:
- herbs
- route
- privacy
I typed in "what is my name?" and it took me to a video of a southern preacher's sermon. lol
"Improve your American pronunciation".
Search term : Aluminium
Result : American saying Aluminum
Search term : Solder
Result : American saying "sodder"
Search term : Aluminium
Result : American saying Aluminum
Search term : Solder
Result : American saying "sodder"
I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. You can argue that "aluminium" and "aluminum" are two different words, each pronounced the same way in Britain as in the US, but with the former being common in Britain and rare in the US and the other vice versa.
But there is only one word "solder", and in most of the US it's pronounced like "sodder" would be, if that were a word at all.
But there is only one word "solder", and in most of the US it's pronounced like "sodder" would be, if that were a word at all.
I think they're trying to say it's American-focused, rather than English-focused. A search for "aluminium" returning pronunciation for "aluminum" contradicts your idea.
Leaving the "l" out of "solder" is just bizarre to me as a New Zealander :-)
Leaving the "l" out of "solder" is just bizarre to me as a New Zealander :-)
Ah, that makes sense. If you want exclusively British pronunciations, you can choose that option. I think it's equally reasonable to say that "aluminum" is the US pronunciation of the single word "alumin(i)um", I was just trying to divine GGP's argument.
"Sodder" was equally bizarre to me when I heard it.
"Sodder" was equally bizarre to me when I heard it.
This could be a good way to build a large tagged dataset to train a neural net TTS engine.
this is awesome, but I feel Scottish and Irish accents are underrepresented as per usual. Would you mind adding some videos from Kevin Bridges, Franky Boyle, Dara O'Brien, Chris O'Dowd and Dylan Moran pleeeeeease?
Man I wish I had this when learning English.
I want it for German
Love it, does anyone know of a similar service for chinese ?.
There is Chinese in the dropdown list.
Searching for “gif” left me even more confused than I was.
This is very useful for searching youtube subtitles.
It sometimes work for me to learn new words :-)
Interesting, works even for pt-br vs pt-pt!
How did you even come up with this idea ?
Thank you for this valuable work.
lets try "data" and "finance".
dei·tuh not da ta fai·nans not fi nance
dei·tuh not da ta fai·nans not fi nance
damn this is very useful, congrats
I wouldn't normally point this out, but considering the site is about learning languages, the mistake on the homepage:
> (Advance search)
is glaring. That should be "Advanced search" as in "click here to perform an advanced (adj) search," not as in "click here to advance (verb) [a] search," which is nonsensical.
> (Advance search)
is glaring. That should be "Advanced search" as in "click here to perform an advanced (adj) search," not as in "click here to advance (verb) [a] search," which is nonsensical.
Okay, context makes you mostly right. But. Advance is also a adjective, as in "Advance booking", which is a booking in advance. Lots of people incorrectly write "Advanced booking" instead, which is a technologically superior booking, and probably not what they meant.
Advance as an adjective (as in advance booking) means "ahead of time," whereas advanced as an adjective (as in advanced search) means "highly developed or complex," which is what is appropriate here.
I was not trying to suggest in my original comment that "advance" as an adjective was inherently incorrect. All I was saying was that the phrase "advance search" is meaningless.
I was not trying to suggest in my original comment that "advance" as an adjective was inherently incorrect. All I was saying was that the phrase "advance search" is meaningless.
https://forvo.com/word/scheduled/#en is very interesting
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The one criticism that I have is that many of these videos are from ted talks or speeches by politicians. During speeches people will inflect words differently than in everyday conversation, especially politicians. I got one Theresa May speech and the rest were Americans.