Ask HN: Is it possible to get asylum for developers?
As you know russians dropped about 6k military force units to Ukraine, and soon the can start to show some aggression. And for me as a developer(and I think for lots of people there) this situation seems very scary, and I'm starting to look some variants of relocation from Ukraine to some peaceful place and maybe to work remotely or to find place where I can be hired. How to do you think, what can be an optimal solution for this case?
7 comments
I work at a company in Amsterdam that employs a lot of non-natives (myself included) including several Russians & Ukrainians. I don't think it would be appropriate to name-drop the company given the topic, but contact me if you're interested.
Anyway, given my admittedly somewhat limited knowledge of immigration law I don't think what you want to be looking at at all is getting asylum somewhere. That's going to be a process that's a giant pain in the ass anywhere in the world.
There's also lots of major caveats with getting asylum, generally to do with you or your ethnic/social group being specifically discriminated against or otherwise in danger. You're generally not going to get asylum just because you don't like the general security situation in your country of residence. If that was the case the first world would pretty much grant blanked asylum to millions to billions of people living in the failed states of the world.
If you have a specialist skill such as being a developer a much better and quicker path to emigrating is to get a work visa somewhere, and go from there to potentially getting a permanent residence permit or even citizenship
Anyway, given my admittedly somewhat limited knowledge of immigration law I don't think what you want to be looking at at all is getting asylum somewhere. That's going to be a process that's a giant pain in the ass anywhere in the world.
There's also lots of major caveats with getting asylum, generally to do with you or your ethnic/social group being specifically discriminated against or otherwise in danger. You're generally not going to get asylum just because you don't like the general security situation in your country of residence. If that was the case the first world would pretty much grant blanked asylum to millions to billions of people living in the failed states of the world.
If you have a specialist skill such as being a developer a much better and quicker path to emigrating is to get a work visa somewhere, and go from there to potentially getting a permanent residence permit or even citizenship
Thank you for the comment, could you tell please, what kind of projects do you have in your company? Do they have ruby or rails positions, or frontend-based positions open?
I work at Booking.com. We don't use RoR but yeah, we have plenty of frontend positions open: https://workingatbooking.com I'm also happy to answer any of your questions, my E-Mail contact is in my profile.
But aside from where I work more generally there's lots of companies in more stable countries in Europe (or elsewhere) that would be willing to hire a competent developer of whatever skills you might have.
I just wanted to point out to you that you'd have a much easier time if you could get a work visa and work your way towards permanent residence or citizenship than starting out trying to request asylum.
But aside from where I work more generally there's lots of companies in more stable countries in Europe (or elsewhere) that would be willing to hire a competent developer of whatever skills you might have.
I just wanted to point out to you that you'd have a much easier time if you could get a work visa and work your way towards permanent residence or citizenship than starting out trying to request asylum.
Booking.com has an unfortunate reputation in the perl community
http://blogs.perl.org/users/booking_employee/2014/01/booking...
http://blogs.perl.org/users/booking_employee/2014/01/booking...
> I don't think it would be appropriate to name-drop the company given the topic
Next response:
> I work at Booking.com
Wat? Sorry, things like this really stick out to me, and I thought it was odd. I have no opinion you choosing to, or not to, reveal your employer.
Next response:
> I work at Booking.com
Wat? Sorry, things like this really stick out to me, and I thought it was odd. I have no opinion you choosing to, or not to, reveal your employer.
I wasn't expecting a follow-up question to be a question about the company I was working at in particular. I mainly replied to give some (admittedly amateur) general advice on seeking asylum v.s. pursuing a work visa.
Since he did ask what projects we have at the company that I happen to work at I thought it was simpler just to mention where I work.
We have a lot of promotion & hiring material online, and it's way easier just to mention where I work and have the OP check that out than for me to write up some some long-winded description of what the company does, all the while trying not to mention what company I'm talking about.
It's not like there's that many companies in Amsterdam that run online hotel booking websites. So any interested reader could infer what company I was talking about anyway if I were to describe what sort of projects we work on.
Since he did ask what projects we have at the company that I happen to work at I thought it was simpler just to mention where I work.
We have a lot of promotion & hiring material online, and it's way easier just to mention where I work and have the OP check that out than for me to write up some some long-winded description of what the company does, all the while trying not to mention what company I'm talking about.
It's not like there's that many companies in Amsterdam that run online hotel booking websites. So any interested reader could infer what company I was talking about anyway if I were to describe what sort of projects we work on.
Many other-than-rich countries have permissive visa programs for people who have job offers: Brazil, India, the Philippines, United Arab Emirates, Mexico, and others. I've heard the market for developers in Brazil is pretty hot right now.
Getting a work permit will almost certainly be easier than being granted asylum. That said, most civilized countries won't deport people to a war zone [1]. So, if you happen to be in such a country when a shooting war breaks out then you may be able to stay for the duration.
[1] for example: http://www.uscis.gov/humanitarian/temporary-protected-status...
Getting a work permit will almost certainly be easier than being granted asylum. That said, most civilized countries won't deport people to a war zone [1]. So, if you happen to be in such a country when a shooting war breaks out then you may be able to stay for the duration.
[1] for example: http://www.uscis.gov/humanitarian/temporary-protected-status...
Wow. I hope that you and your family are all right.
I would doubt that there is a asylum process specific for developers, at least for asylum in the U.S. (in that I would doubt that the USFG discriminates between developer and non-developer applicants.) It does seem like, again, in the U.S., the process still faces some kinks [1].
However, I know that there is a plethora of nation-states which recognize the universal right of asylum. I would suggest that, should you or your family ever be in a position in which you feel that you will face prosecution (even persecution, maybe?), you should actively research the possibility of attaining asylum.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_of_asylum#United_States
I would doubt that there is a asylum process specific for developers, at least for asylum in the U.S. (in that I would doubt that the USFG discriminates between developer and non-developer applicants.) It does seem like, again, in the U.S., the process still faces some kinks [1].
However, I know that there is a plethora of nation-states which recognize the universal right of asylum. I would suggest that, should you or your family ever be in a position in which you feel that you will face prosecution (even persecution, maybe?), you should actively research the possibility of attaining asylum.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_of_asylum#United_States
Thank you, guys, for the feedback, maybe asylum isn't suitable solution for me. I have no experience in these issues, I just wan't to securely write code and having fun. I have a pretty nice job here in Ukraine but I'm afraid that soon that it is possible to lost everything. So just looking for some variants to save myself and family from this possible hell.
By making every problem sound specific to developers, its presence on Hacker News can be justified. Developers are also people, so yes, you can get asylum.
Consider Poland?
I am not sure about long-stay-working visa permits for Ukrainians in Poland, but I know that for Czech republic, it can take up to several months to have all the burocracy in order.
I know this, because I work for a large multi-national, and my boss always complains when he has to deal with relocating people from non EU countries to Czech republic.
On the other hand, it happens reasonably often, in two years we hired several people from Armenia, Serbia, Russia, Ukraine ...
I know this, because I work for a large multi-national, and my boss always complains when he has to deal with relocating people from non EU countries to Czech republic.
On the other hand, it happens reasonably often, in two years we hired several people from Armenia, Serbia, Russia, Ukraine ...
What about jobs in Poland, do they have Ruby or RoR projects that hiring?
Getting out of harm's way is a wise choice. Don't count on getting asylum though.
Your destination would depend on how much money you've got saved up, of course. But if you want to live cheaply, Vietnam might be a good option. It's supposedly easy to get a long-term visa there (I got six months in 2011), and cost of living is low. I believe applying for a visa through an agent is the typical (or only?) way, but it shouldn't take more than a week or two. You can find these agents on the Internet. Mine wanted the money transferred through Western Union, I believe.
Ho Chi Minh City would probably be a good choice, there's some startup culture going on, and you could even find a Westerner there who could employ you.
Just go for it, and good luck!
Your destination would depend on how much money you've got saved up, of course. But if you want to live cheaply, Vietnam might be a good option. It's supposedly easy to get a long-term visa there (I got six months in 2011), and cost of living is low. I believe applying for a visa through an agent is the typical (or only?) way, but it shouldn't take more than a week or two. You can find these agents on the Internet. Mine wanted the money transferred through Western Union, I believe.
Ho Chi Minh City would probably be a good choice, there's some startup culture going on, and you could even find a Westerner there who could employ you.
Just go for it, and good luck!