Ask HN: Startups using Python happy without Rails?
Which web app (or other) startups are using Python (+django/pylons/etc) and don't feel a desire to use ruby+rails, or any slight regret that they didn't go down the path of Rails?
8 comments
Really? All major languages have a web framework that's on par with Rails these days. Actually, most languages (including Ruby) have a web framework / ORM / templating system combination that's better than Rails.
As long as you don't pick something like Java or C++, you'll be fine. Worry about your idea, not which flavor of nearly-identical languages you pick. Pick the one you know; Ruby, Python, and Perl are all the same language with tiny superficial differences.
As long as you don't pick something like Java or C++, you'll be fine. Worry about your idea, not which flavor of nearly-identical languages you pick. Pick the one you know; Ruby, Python, and Perl are all the same language with tiny superficial differences.
You know...after doing both Django and Rails in depth, I really don't agree with this sentiment. Rails brings things to the table that Django doesn't, and Django brings some things to the table that Rails doesn't. Understanding the differences between the frameworks won't come easily, unfortunately...you almost have to try each. Any judgment without some sort of true experimentation (at least a full reading of the docs, and one relatively complex test app) will be superficial at best.
Python has a lot of different options for web frameworks, so there's not really any void to be filled. You can go simple with web.py or flask, you can go full-featured with Django, or you can roll your own with something like Tornado, SQLAlchemy, and Jinja.
You can see some of the sites running Django at http://www.djangosites.org/.
You can see some of the sites running Django at http://www.djangosites.org/.
Just ported our app from Rails to Django - couldn't be happier. I'd still quick prototype in Rails or use it for simple apps, but pain starts to increase with app complexity. Django admin is awesome and SQLAlchemy is maybe the best ORM ever.
I use Python/Django for all my web projects.
I've never used Rails, and haven't felt a great need to go down that road. Sure, I'd love learning Ruby/Rails for the sake of learning it. Honestly though, if I ever decide to learn something new, it won't be Ruby/Rails, which is supposedly very similar to Python/Django. I'd rather learn something completely different.
I've never used Rails, and haven't felt a great need to go down that road. Sure, I'd love learning Ruby/Rails for the sake of learning it. Honestly though, if I ever decide to learn something new, it won't be Ruby/Rails, which is supposedly very similar to Python/Django. I'd rather learn something completely different.
this is a holywar topic of course, but why would anyone regret if python frameworks are superior in almost every possible way? ruby is a fun language and rails is a fun magic framework suitable for pet projects but when your codebase becomes large, then it's a mess to support. we switched to python and could not be happier, the only problem is supporting an old rails app. so your question is wrong.
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I was thinking about switching to Rails many, many times in past. I've messed around with it and coded up some util type stuff (probably not enough) and found that it doesn't really fill some great void that's missing in Python. Of course Rails does offer a hipper, younger, more vibrant community. If you already have a strong toolset in Python why switch? I don't write nearly the amount of server side code as I used to anyway.
Also Google still supposedly uses Python.
Also Google still supposedly uses Python.
Come on!!!! Seriously??? Do we want to start another of those python v/s ruby or this v/s that kind of debate. It seems really frustrating that such questions frequently make it to the front page. These are just pointless.
Agreed, I'm not taking the bait on this one. Personally I use (django|rails) but I haven't tried anything but $1 and don't want to.
C'mon, Ruby's just Python with slightly different syntax.
But seriously, it's more and more common to write webapps in Javascript and to keep your server-side views and controllers minimal. And for that minimal REST frameworks like web.py are just enough. Full blown Rails (or Django) webapps are bad for caching and do not provide the best user experience possible.
It's glorified PHP.
EDIT:
Oh, thread's dead. Anyway:
> can lead to significant differences in ways of working, code being produced and community building.
Sure, that was mostly joke anyway.
> That I completely disagree with, though. And the paragraph which precedes.
Would love to know why.
> How are full blown Rails/Django webapps bad for caching?
If you're doing all your user interaction server side than almost all of your views become dynamic.
But seriously, it's more and more common to write webapps in Javascript and to keep your server-side views and controllers minimal. And for that minimal REST frameworks like web.py are just enough. Full blown Rails (or Django) webapps are bad for caching and do not provide the best user experience possible.
It's glorified PHP.
EDIT:
Oh, thread's dead. Anyway:
> can lead to significant differences in ways of working, code being produced and community building.
Sure, that was mostly joke anyway.
> That I completely disagree with, though. And the paragraph which precedes.
Would love to know why.
> How are full blown Rails/Django webapps bad for caching?
If you're doing all your user interaction server side than almost all of your views become dynamic.
> C'mon, Ruby's just Python with slightly different syntax.
That's overall true, but the pervasive use of blocks (as crippled as they may be) and a culture of metaprogramming, as well as some Perlish inheritance (I would guess) can lead to significant differences in ways of working, code being produced and community building.
Ruby and Python are very similar syntactically and semantically, but have greatly diverge socially.
> It's glorified PHP.
That I completely disagree with, though. And the paragraph which precedes.
That's overall true, but the pervasive use of blocks (as crippled as they may be) and a culture of metaprogramming, as well as some Perlish inheritance (I would guess) can lead to significant differences in ways of working, code being produced and community building.
Ruby and Python are very similar syntactically and semantically, but have greatly diverge socially.
> It's glorified PHP.
That I completely disagree with, though. And the paragraph which precedes.
How are full blown Rails/Django webapps bad for caching?