Addressing Founder Depression – YC Hackathon project(docs.google.com)
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Addressing Founder Depression – YC Hackathon project
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1Sn82CL2YjFMgZdu2o2sWKFBoGH2VGihQ7LfnD6-kGv0/viewform
7 comments
I wholeheartedly see your point, but I believe the well-intentioned objective is to gain perspective from like-minded individuals who can empathize. Much like a support group. Depressed alcoholics share a common bond not only around depression, but the specific problems associated with alcohol. Founders often find themselves lonely with their problems and want to connect with others with similar experiences.
This answer encapsulates what we want to do really well!
To me the main issue is that founders are stereotyped as relentlessly upbeat. And Steve Job, the icon of founders, is described as having a reality distortion field. So a lot of founders feel like they need to create their own reality distortion field, so the idea that your field can't overcome depression is a a double-slap in the face.
It's hard to criticize well-intentioned efforts, but I think it's worth noting that there are a lot of assumptions being made about "founder depression."
Depression is often confused with anxiety disorders, and complicating matters, it's not uncommon for these to be co-occurring. A lot of the symptoms described in the recent posts by Sam Altman and TechCrunch on "founder depression" actually sound more like symptoms of anxiety disorders than they do symptoms of clinical depression.
Before an individual jumps to the conclusion that he or she is suffering from depression, it would be wise to seek help from a mental health professional who can make a proper diagnosis.
Depression is often confused with anxiety disorders, and complicating matters, it's not uncommon for these to be co-occurring. A lot of the symptoms described in the recent posts by Sam Altman and TechCrunch on "founder depression" actually sound more like symptoms of anxiety disorders than they do symptoms of clinical depression.
Before an individual jumps to the conclusion that he or she is suffering from depression, it would be wise to seek help from a mental health professional who can make a proper diagnosis.
Hi there, I'm on the YC Hacks team working on this. I agree that "founder depression" is somewhat vague and potentially confusing in describing what we're doing. The intent is simply to anonymously connect people who are going through similar situations, whether positive or negative, in order to edify and support one another.
Based on both anecdotal evidence and recent articles, it seems as though people in the startup community often don't have many compassionate outlets they can leverage to talk to others who are either going through something similar or have gone through something similar before. By finding someone relatable to share experiences or learnings, they can release some of the pent-up emotion or frustration that they have and be able to move forward.
Furthermore, this is not designed to replace working with a mental health professional--not in the slightest! This is more purpose-built around finding peers who have the right context to really understand or comment on what you're going through and empathize. This isn't meant to be a counseling service.
Based on both anecdotal evidence and recent articles, it seems as though people in the startup community often don't have many compassionate outlets they can leverage to talk to others who are either going through something similar or have gone through something similar before. By finding someone relatable to share experiences or learnings, they can release some of the pent-up emotion or frustration that they have and be able to move forward.
Furthermore, this is not designed to replace working with a mental health professional--not in the slightest! This is more purpose-built around finding peers who have the right context to really understand or comment on what you're going through and empathize. This isn't meant to be a counseling service.
> Based on both anecdotal evidence and recent articles, it seems as though people in the startup community often don't have many compassionate outlets they can leverage to talk to others who are either going through something similar or have gone through something similar before.
There's a huge difference between providing an outlet for startup founders to commiserate with each other and providing an outlet for individuals who believe they're suffering from depression to obtain support. Again, it's hard to criticize well-intentioned efforts, but my (hopefully) constructive criticism is that you seem to be blurring the lines. You can build a useful founder support network without focusing on depression.
Clinical depression is a disorder that has a variety of causes. Some of them are social or psychological, but there may also be biochemical causes. A startup founder's depression may have less to do with his or her startup experience than one might think, in which case focusing on this part of the person's life could be more harmful than helpful.
An individual who may be suffering from clinical depression (or an anxiety disorder) should be encouraged to obtain a professional diagnosis, and treatment should be guided by a professional whom that individual trusts.
> This isn't meant to be a counseling service.
Easily said, but harder to enforce. Case in point: one of the services you're considering using, 7 Cups of Tea, is positioned as an online counseling/therapy portal.
There's a huge difference between providing an outlet for startup founders to commiserate with each other and providing an outlet for individuals who believe they're suffering from depression to obtain support. Again, it's hard to criticize well-intentioned efforts, but my (hopefully) constructive criticism is that you seem to be blurring the lines. You can build a useful founder support network without focusing on depression.
Clinical depression is a disorder that has a variety of causes. Some of them are social or psychological, but there may also be biochemical causes. A startup founder's depression may have less to do with his or her startup experience than one might think, in which case focusing on this part of the person's life could be more harmful than helpful.
An individual who may be suffering from clinical depression (or an anxiety disorder) should be encouraged to obtain a professional diagnosis, and treatment should be guided by a professional whom that individual trusts.
> This isn't meant to be a counseling service.
Easily said, but harder to enforce. Case in point: one of the services you're considering using, 7 Cups of Tea, is positioned as an online counseling/therapy portal.
> There's a huge difference between providing an outlet for startup founders to commiserate with each other and providing an outlet for individuals who believe they're suffering from depression to obtain support. Again, it's hard to criticize well-intentioned efforts, but my (hopefully) constructive criticism is that you seem to be blurring the lines. You can build a useful founder support network without focusing on depression.
We're definitely on the same page and our goal is to do the former rather than the latter. Describing it as a founder depression product was ultimately incorrect and we're moving away from that description here at YC Hacks. I definitely appreciate the distinction and your constructive criticism.
> Easily said, but harder to enforce. Case in point: one of the services you're considering using, 7 Cups of Tea, is positioned as an online counseling/therapy portal.
Also a great observation -- with regard to 7 Cups of Tea, the company is an inspiration point but we are not using them and we don't believe our service is competitive to their offering.
We're definitely on the same page and our goal is to do the former rather than the latter. Describing it as a founder depression product was ultimately incorrect and we're moving away from that description here at YC Hacks. I definitely appreciate the distinction and your constructive criticism.
> Easily said, but harder to enforce. Case in point: one of the services you're considering using, 7 Cups of Tea, is positioned as an online counseling/therapy portal.
Also a great observation -- with regard to 7 Cups of Tea, the company is an inspiration point but we are not using them and we don't believe our service is competitive to their offering.
Would love to work with you on this :). If interested, shoot me an email at [email protected].
Will do! We're hard at work right now but will reach out.
The smartest thing I ever did was join a men's group. It's not depression-focused per se, but in my case it became something of a depression support group. I wish I had done this 20 years ago, and I say that everyone I meet who shows an interest.
I thought depression falls under anxiety-spectrum umbrella, but you're right - it doesn't, it's a separate disease: http://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/topics/anxiety-disorders/inde...
Depression and anxiety are often comorbid and it is more likely that you will see both disorders rather than one in absence of the other. There is a lot of research going into determining why these disorders are often tangled together, some studies [1] suggest that depression can stem from anxiety disorders and that depression can exacerbate anxiety further. Of course there is anxiety-depression and depression-anxiety, finding out which of the these an individual has is a crucial step towards providing sufficient aid. One of the large issues is how hard it can be untangles these two disorders which is an important step in therapy.
[1] http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0010440X00...
[1] http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0010440X00...
I think a serious contribution to Founder Depression is that we're always expected to be on. If anyone asks about your startup you're supposed to be super-motivated, encouraged to give off the appearance that everythings a-ok in case word might get out to investors/competitors/etc.
The reality is that some weeks/months really, really suck. If more of us recognised and accepted this fact then I think it'd go a long way to combatting FD.
The reality is that some weeks/months really, really suck. If more of us recognised and accepted this fact then I think it'd go a long way to combatting FD.
I would like to introduce myself to this group as a former founder and CEO, psychiatrist, and mentor at the UCSF accelerator. My team includes a psychology professor at UC Berkeley and a research assistant. After the suicides of several inspiring entrepreneurs we decided to study the relationship between human factors - including mood - and a variety of outcomes including success/failure, and mental health issues. Over 400 entrepreneurs responded to our recent survey and we are now analyzing the data. We are finding meaningful results that we hope to use to educate entrepreneurs and to develop effective mental health risk reduction / performance enhancement resources for our community. Many of the questions raised in this conversation should be pretty well addressed by this research, and I will be happy to keep this community posted.
Michael A. Freeman, MD, Clinical Professor of Psychiatry, UCSF and Mentor, The Entrepreneurship Center at UCSF.
Contact information for the following post:
[email protected]; www.MichaelAFreemanMD.com
Our research is suggesting that there are actually some significant differences between the way mood spectrum conditions manifest in entrepreneurs vs. a more general population. Will have much more to report about this later. Regarding the relentlessly upbeat stereotype of founders, this image is in denial about "the downside of being up."
I would like to introduce myself to this group as a former founder and CEO, psychiatrist, and mentor at the UCSF accelerator. My team includes a psychology professor at UC Berkeley and a research assistant. Michael A. Freeman, MD, Clinical Professor of Psychiatry, UCSF and Mentor, The Entrepreneurship Center at UCSF.
I would like to introduce myself to this group as a former founder and CEO, psychiatrist, and mentor at the UCSF accelerator. My team includes a psychology professor at UC Berkeley and a research assistant. Michael A. Freeman, MD, Clinical Professor of Psychiatry, UCSF and Mentor, The Entrepreneurship Center at UCSF.
> We want to create a safe place for founders to share their specific issues and solicit support and advice from fellow founders or those who can empathize.
Sounds similar to https://startupsanonymous.com
Sounds similar to https://startupsanonymous.com
Have you guys checked out Dev Pressed (http://devpressed.com/)?
Completely -- that was one of our inspirations.
Contact me asap. I explored the same idea last year including an interview series with prominent entrepreneurs experiencing depression.
[email protected]
[email protected]
I suffer from depression and I am not a founder we all have issues so why do we have to label this depression and founder's depression. These people are no different that anyone else just different problems.
seems like we should actually be doing something to help people with depression and not just a certain group just because they are founders. After all depression is the same regardless if you are a founder, a manager, a business owner, a student.