Blue Bottle acquires Tonx(tonx.org)
tonx.org
Blue Bottle acquires Tonx
https://tonx.org/frequency/joining-forces?utm_source=t.co&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=frequency32
11 comments
I'm a current Tonx subscriber, and I bought Blue Bottle when you could only get it from that hole in the wall on Linden Lane.
But for some reason this announcement still feels like a loss to me. It's probably my aversion to all those SF people who rave about Blue Bottle, but get drinks that drown out the coffee flavor with milk and sugar.
But it'll probably work out for the best.
But for some reason this announcement still feels like a loss to me. It's probably my aversion to all those SF people who rave about Blue Bottle, but get drinks that drown out the coffee flavor with milk and sugar.
But it'll probably work out for the best.
I agree. The beauty of Tonx is that it's all about the coffee itself. No milk, no sugar, no dilution. Blue Bottle seems more about the coffee drink and less about the coffee
The Blue Bottle siphon bar in Chelsea (NYC) is a bit of a step back in the direction of "coffee itself". The brew methods are on the fancy side, but you can get the flight of two siphon coffees and compare the different qualities of the beans and such :)
That actually makes me feel much better about the matter, good to know!
I'm really conflicted by this.
The good: Tonx is awesome. Blue Bottle is great. I can't imagine coffee quality will decline due to a merger.
The bad: Tonx has lost a lot of agility. Will great and potentially risky campaigns like the recent Starbucks campaign [0] still be possible with a retail infrastructure to support and worry about?
The ugly: Tonx brings to the table two amazing single origin roasts every single month. Blue Bottle seems to be focusing on expanding their digital presence with this deal [1] and at least in my experience, that is NOT what makes Tonx so fantastic.
It will be interesting to see where this goes.
[0]: https://tonx.org/better [1]: http://blog.bluebottlecoffee.com/post/82020818086/welcome-ab...
The good: Tonx is awesome. Blue Bottle is great. I can't imagine coffee quality will decline due to a merger.
The bad: Tonx has lost a lot of agility. Will great and potentially risky campaigns like the recent Starbucks campaign [0] still be possible with a retail infrastructure to support and worry about?
The ugly: Tonx brings to the table two amazing single origin roasts every single month. Blue Bottle seems to be focusing on expanding their digital presence with this deal [1] and at least in my experience, that is NOT what makes Tonx so fantastic.
It will be interesting to see where this goes.
[0]: https://tonx.org/better [1]: http://blog.bluebottlecoffee.com/post/82020818086/welcome-ab...
I have been using Tonx for about a year and it has been awesome. Hopefully this doesn't change much about the service.
I don't think it will in the short term.
This is a really smart move by Blue Bottle though. Overnight, they have a Web presence and a mail-order/distribution network.
This is a really smart move by Blue Bottle though. Overnight, they have a Web presence and a mail-order/distribution network.
Interesting. Blue Bottle already offers subscription coffee by mail. I believe it is cheaper than Tonx, and much better coffee in my humble opinion with the ability to choose your beans. I'm hoping the quality and pricing flows towards Blue Bottle instead of the other way around.
Tonx's selection is broader, with 26 shipments a year you get 26 different single origin beans. On Blue Bottle site I chose a subscription for a drip coffee maker and was given a choice of 4 flavors.
I have been with Tonx since near the beginning and love their coffee. A friend of mine even worked for a competitor (regular coffee co.) for a while but I couldn't make the switch due to the lack of variety.
I just hope that Tonx won't lose it's laid back 'drink it how you like it' attitude in favor of the coffee Puritanism I experienced at Blue Bottle a year or two back.
I just hope that Tonx won't lose it's laid back 'drink it how you like it' attitude in favor of the coffee Puritanism I experienced at Blue Bottle a year or two back.
As I've written on HN before, both of these brands have fallen out of favor with me recently. Blue Bottle is living off of a reputation it soon won't have, and local roasters have better beans than Tonx does, at a better price. For people that don't have roasters in their city I guess Tonx is a good choice, though.
You hipster. It's starting to get a larger following, so you can't like it anymore. Everyone already knows, quality doesn't go downhill until the stock is publicly traded. Then they start "value engineering".
I don't drink milk-coffee drinks so when I evaluate a coffee shop it is strictly on the quality of the coffee. Whether it is a cup of black coffee or their beans. Blue Bottle's coffee (read: not espresso) beans are absolutely horrid.
I’ll be interested to see where it goes. I’ve been with Tonx for almost a year, and I really like it, despite having easy access to great local roasters, who I still visit. Tonx provides some variety and flavors, varietals that I might not normally seek out. I get the smallest possible shipment each month, and its a relatively minor expense that provides something new.
Will be interested to see how it inevitably changes.
Will be interested to see how it inevitably changes.
I like this use case :)
What is your experience with Blue Bottle? I used to live in downtown Oakland, and would get a cappuccino at their roastery down there and it was spot on ever time. Amazing. I've been to their new location in South Berkeley and they made a really bad cappuccino for my friend, but I had a shot that was quite nice.
Just curious what you've seen.
Just curious what you've seen.
And now we know that cash infusion Blue Bottle got is being put to good use.
Man I wish these companies stopped assigning flavors to the their roasts and just listed them as medium, dark or light.
I like medium roasts, every other is either lost on me or is not guaranteed to be consistent between roasts.
I like medium roasts, every other is either lost on me or is not guaranteed to be consistent between roasts.
Almost all "quality" coffee is done at a light roast, as the more you roast a coffee the less of the actual coffee you're tasting. Anything you get from Blue Bottle, Stumptown, Intelligentsia, etc. is going to be a light roast.
I generally pick coffee beans by smell and i get them at whole foods, oftentimes within a day or two of the roast date. Ive tried sightglass, ritual, four barrel and blue bottle(not available at whole foods, but some other places in the bay area).
Pretty much none of them are ever labeled dark, medium or light roasted and instead they come up with these imaginative flavor descriptions which I never appreciated in wines and I definitely dont appreciate in coffee.
Based on my fairly good sense of smell, ive learned to distinguish medium roasts from dark and light onces because dark ones are generally too burnt and bitter for my taste while light ones are too acidic.
All of these coffee brands do have dark roasts(yes even Blue Bottle -- do you think Three Africans is light?) and medium roasts and plenty of light roasts. Its just tough to find any that are labeled as such
Pretty much none of them are ever labeled dark, medium or light roasted and instead they come up with these imaginative flavor descriptions which I never appreciated in wines and I definitely dont appreciate in coffee.
Based on my fairly good sense of smell, ive learned to distinguish medium roasts from dark and light onces because dark ones are generally too burnt and bitter for my taste while light ones are too acidic.
All of these coffee brands do have dark roasts(yes even Blue Bottle -- do you think Three Africans is light?) and medium roasts and plenty of light roasts. Its just tough to find any that are labeled as such
I don't want to start a war but I think labeling coffee by the roast level is far too simplistic for most people. The roast level as you've described really just tells us what the bean looks like, i.e light medium & dark. I'm a huge proponent of lighter roasts, but not for the color. More because higher roast levels get in the way of the beautiful flavor inherent in good coffee (the corollary of this is that it's easy to hide bad coffee in over roasting - hello Starbucks)
The flavor profiles aren't "imaginative descriptions". Yes they are very subjective, but that doesn't mean they do not exist, just that our senses aren't good at detecting & describing them. To give an example, I run an online coffee company and over the last few months we've shipped coffees that genuinely smell everything from a Papua New Guinea that smelled incredibly like chocolate & nuts through to a Yirg that smelled uncannily like strawberries & cream. Honestly I thought the last one was BS until I smelled it. I wouldn't consider that I have an amazing sense of smell but I can tell the difference between three or four unshipped types of coffee that we have in our packing space by smelling the degassing valve.
tl;dr There are so many differences between coffee beans for a description of the roast level to adequately describe them
The flavor profiles aren't "imaginative descriptions". Yes they are very subjective, but that doesn't mean they do not exist, just that our senses aren't good at detecting & describing them. To give an example, I run an online coffee company and over the last few months we've shipped coffees that genuinely smell everything from a Papua New Guinea that smelled incredibly like chocolate & nuts through to a Yirg that smelled uncannily like strawberries & cream. Honestly I thought the last one was BS until I smelled it. I wouldn't consider that I have an amazing sense of smell but I can tell the difference between three or four unshipped types of coffee that we have in our packing space by smelling the degassing valve.
tl;dr There are so many differences between coffee beans for a description of the roast level to adequately describe them
There was a freakonomics episode called 'Do more expensive wines taste better' which essentially presented wine experts with a a blind test of different wines and they were not able to tell which ones were cheaper and which ones were pricier based on the 'flavor profiles' that they detected.
While it doesnt mean that there are no flavor profiles on roasted coffee beans, what it means is detection of the flavor profile is probably very subjective. In my experience flavor profiles are rarely guaranteed between roasts, one thing i could always tell if this particular roast is acidic or too dark.
This is just my perception. I usually make my coffee using a Capresso Burr grinder and aeropress. You can usually find me at whole foods sniffing the timestamped paper bags of coffee until i settle on something that doesnt smell too burnt or too acidic.
While it doesnt mean that there are no flavor profiles on roasted coffee beans, what it means is detection of the flavor profile is probably very subjective. In my experience flavor profiles are rarely guaranteed between roasts, one thing i could always tell if this particular roast is acidic or too dark.
This is just my perception. I usually make my coffee using a Capresso Burr grinder and aeropress. You can usually find me at whole foods sniffing the timestamped paper bags of coffee until i settle on something that doesnt smell too burnt or too acidic.
Seems like a merger one can feel ok about.
Blue Bottle -> Broom in Harry Potter (GOF, advertisement at world cup)
Tonx -> Harry Potter character
Tonx -> Harry Potter character
Explain please.
Not really relevant the link between the two being from the same fictional world... gave me a chuckle.
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Bluebottle
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Nymphadora_Tonks
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Bluebottle
http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Nymphadora_Tonks
edit: I took a look at the Blue Bottle service just now. While the price point is half of what I pay for Tonx for the same subscription, it seems like you get the same bag every time? Part of the fun of Tonx is the fact that they send you stuff that they think is great from all over the world, and not just the same thing every two weeks.