Ask HN: Is my co-founder not suitable for a startup?
15 comments
How does his output and skills compare to the other developers? And what type of product is your startup building?
There's a wide variety of working styles that can work out for startups. Don't fall into the startup mythology of believing you have to work 7 days a week, 8-12 hours a day just for the sake of working all the time. Over the long run, you end up being less productive than a team that takes a more measured pace, because you tend to get tunnel vision and miss big opportunities in the haste to get your current goals done. Startups generally tend to be marathons, not sprints; that code you wrote at 3:00 AM in the morning early in your startup's history may end up killing it a year later when everything's been based off it and you find a flaw in the design.
OTOH, there are real cases when you need to crunch, and some startups (based on their product idea) need to crunch more than others. If you're trying to capitalize on someone else's platform that just got to market, it really behooves you to be faster than everyone else. The early iPhone and FaceBook app developers made a killing; the people who got in later, not so much. If you're commercializing academic research, this isn't as much of a factor, because there are many few competitors with the specific technical skills needed to replicate your product. Same if you're in a niche market that requires lots of specialized domain knowledge.
Regardless, you need to work out the expectations with your cofounder ASAP. If one of you expects to be working constantly and the other wants weekends off to be with his girlfriend, that's going to be a problem. It may not mean he's unsuitable for startups, but it probably means he's unsuitable for this startup. I've turned down cofounder positions because the level of intensity that the other cofounders wanted was very different from what I could sustain; that's just a bad situation waiting to happen.
There's a wide variety of working styles that can work out for startups. Don't fall into the startup mythology of believing you have to work 7 days a week, 8-12 hours a day just for the sake of working all the time. Over the long run, you end up being less productive than a team that takes a more measured pace, because you tend to get tunnel vision and miss big opportunities in the haste to get your current goals done. Startups generally tend to be marathons, not sprints; that code you wrote at 3:00 AM in the morning early in your startup's history may end up killing it a year later when everything's been based off it and you find a flaw in the design.
OTOH, there are real cases when you need to crunch, and some startups (based on their product idea) need to crunch more than others. If you're trying to capitalize on someone else's platform that just got to market, it really behooves you to be faster than everyone else. The early iPhone and FaceBook app developers made a killing; the people who got in later, not so much. If you're commercializing academic research, this isn't as much of a factor, because there are many few competitors with the specific technical skills needed to replicate your product. Same if you're in a niche market that requires lots of specialized domain knowledge.
Regardless, you need to work out the expectations with your cofounder ASAP. If one of you expects to be working constantly and the other wants weekends off to be with his girlfriend, that's going to be a problem. It may not mean he's unsuitable for startups, but it probably means he's unsuitable for this startup. I've turned down cofounder positions because the level of intensity that the other cofounders wanted was very different from what I could sustain; that's just a bad situation waiting to happen.
Time spent does not always equal output. Some of the best startup founders in the world can do more in a day than another startup founder can do in a week. It's all about what they produce, not how they produce it.
If your partner meets or exceeds your goals of what should be created, then you shouldn't worry. However, if he is truly slowing things down, then that's a problem that needs to be explored further.
If your partner meets or exceeds your goals of what should be created, then you shouldn't worry. However, if he is truly slowing things down, then that's a problem that needs to be explored further.
There's really not enough data to give you great advice.
Is he a developer? Are you a developer? Is he really slow or is he just giving bad estimates on how long things take? Are you shifting specs which causes delays?
You're making character judgments of him and obviously you're biased and we have to take your word for it. You point out some anecdotes on his apparent laziness but you could do the same with anybody.
I think one think you can do is recognize that you and this person may not have the same mindset on how to work. That's not saying he's wrong or that you're right. It's saying that there's a disconnect that should be resolved.
Personally, I agree with nostrademons. Working those kind of hours can happen for crunch time but it's not a long term strategy for a company, even a startup. You'll burn out quickly and everyone will hate each other.
Work hard but take time off and don't neglect the rest of life otherwise you'll end up hating it. Leave time to refresh your batteries.
Is he a developer? Are you a developer? Is he really slow or is he just giving bad estimates on how long things take? Are you shifting specs which causes delays?
You're making character judgments of him and obviously you're biased and we have to take your word for it. You point out some anecdotes on his apparent laziness but you could do the same with anybody.
I think one think you can do is recognize that you and this person may not have the same mindset on how to work. That's not saying he's wrong or that you're right. It's saying that there's a disconnect that should be resolved.
Personally, I agree with nostrademons. Working those kind of hours can happen for crunch time but it's not a long term strategy for a company, even a startup. You'll burn out quickly and everyone will hate each other.
Work hard but take time off and don't neglect the rest of life otherwise you'll end up hating it. Leave time to refresh your batteries.
He's off base taking 10 days off without a reason (illness, etc). That's not cool.
You're way off base on the 3 day weekend. You should both spend an occasional long weekend with a loved one. Life is way too short to not do that. Just don't do it all the time.
I also don't agree with working every single day. You're not helping yourself by not taking breaks. Everyone should have 1-2 days per week of no work to recharge. Even hard core startup founders.
I'd say the magic number is 60 hours per week. Working more is a recipe for burn out. Working less is probably not pushing hard enough.
Once you're doing 60 hours per week your biggest problem is spending all that time in truly productive work. Optimize for that.
You're way off base on the 3 day weekend. You should both spend an occasional long weekend with a loved one. Life is way too short to not do that. Just don't do it all the time.
I also don't agree with working every single day. You're not helping yourself by not taking breaks. Everyone should have 1-2 days per week of no work to recharge. Even hard core startup founders.
I'd say the magic number is 60 hours per week. Working more is a recipe for burn out. Working less is probably not pushing hard enough.
Once you're doing 60 hours per week your biggest problem is spending all that time in truly productive work. Optimize for that.
I think a 3 day weekend is excessive for a birthday, but it sounds like his mindset is as an employee and not a cofounder. That's a recipe for disaster too.
You're focusing too much on it being a 'birthday', traditionally a 1 day event. He spent a long weekend with his girlfriend, which is healthy and worthwhile to do so long as he isn't doing it every week!
>If his attitude and behavior aren't suitable for a startup, then should we split immediately?
I'm not sure that his attitude is 'unsuitable' for a startup, but it certainly sounds like you have antithetical work philosophies, and that could become an even greater problem down the road. It's possible that he's trying to achieve what feels to him like a good work/life balance. It's also possible that he's decided that the project isn't going anywhere, but feels too committed to jump ship. Either way, it sounds like a heart-to-heart discussion is in order.
I'm not sure that his attitude is 'unsuitable' for a startup, but it certainly sounds like you have antithetical work philosophies, and that could become an even greater problem down the road. It's possible that he's trying to achieve what feels to him like a good work/life balance. It's also possible that he's decided that the project isn't going anywhere, but feels too committed to jump ship. Either way, it sounds like a heart-to-heart discussion is in order.
Based on your dissatisfaction, sounds like you all will definitely break up sooner or later. Maybe the question you should ask is when is the right time to break up. From the little info you gave, it sounds like you shouldn't split up right now (as that would effect a "significant" distribution deal). After the launch, you should discuss with him how to transition things (perhaps he stays on and continues to help but at a different capacity).
Thank you for all your answers. It seems like we are in some trouble (sign number one: I'm posting online under a throwaway account).
I'm going to try harder at communicating with him, and then see if he can keep up his side of work to make the two months product launch. I've launched a product of similar scope with the same sized team in a month before, so if we can't do it in two...I'll have my answer.
I'm going to try harder at communicating with him, and then see if he can keep up his side of work to make the two months product launch. I've launched a product of similar scope with the same sized team in a month before, so if we can't do it in two...I'll have my answer.
I second @elgato75. If you're concerned now, then you guys aren't right together... Your co-founder has to be of all things reliable. It doesn't matter how smart they are or how many hours they put in, if they aren't reliable and there's no trust then your startup will have a difficult time succeeding.
Hence the reason why investors are just as likely to invest in a tight team as well as a good idea.
Hence the reason why investors are just as likely to invest in a tight team as well as a good idea.
You know the answer. I work with about 25 ceos in various small businesses. I have not once seen or heard of a person changing their behavior when put on a performance plan.
People are always too slow to fire, but once they do, not once have I seen someone who regretted it. In fact most wish they had done it sooner.
Your gut is screaming that he is not a good fit.
People are always too slow to fire, but once they do, not once have I seen someone who regretted it. In fact most wish they had done it sooner.
Your gut is screaming that he is not a good fit.
I would also add that you are not being overly intense and he is not being overly relaxed. Both styles can work but probably not together because it is the heart of the culture of your company. Do you guys have a buy-sell agreement in place?
Whether or not he is suitable is a co-founder doesn't seem to be the issue. The issue is, is he a suitable co-founder for you? Judging by the way you have phrased everything, I would say he's not a good match for you.
Sounds like you two have a significantly different approach to work styles. Your co-founder probably is suitable for a startup, just maybe not with you.
Slow is smooth. Smooth is fast.
Once, he took a 10 day vacation, even though we would have benefited from him working during those days. He also took an entire weekend plus Friday off to celebrate his girlfriend's birthday.
When I bring this up to him, he implies I'm the one being overly intense. Am I? Ideally, I'd like us both to work 8 - 12 hours a day, 7 days a week.
If his attitude and behavior aren't suitable for a startup, then should we split immediately? We just signed a significant distribution deal and should launch our product in two months. Splitting now could mess that up.