The FBI Is Using Polygraphs to Test Officials' Loyalty(nytimes.com)
nytimes.com
The FBI Is Using Polygraphs to Test Officials' Loyalty
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/07/10/us/politics/fbi-polygraph-kash-patel.html
12 comments
This reminds me of the book Animal Farm, except the corruption here is done by people too incompetent to keep their hand of cards hidden from view. A real power-coup needs to be fast and decisive, and this group is instead just setting themselves up to get absolutely obliterated by the mid-terms in 16 months.
> this group is instead just setting themselves up to get absolutely obliterated by the mid-terms in 16 months.
I'd hope this is the case, but after hundreds prior of examples of otherwise disqualifying behavior, I know there is no threshold for a big part of the voter base.
I'd hope this is the case, but after hundreds prior of examples of otherwise disqualifying behavior, I know there is no threshold for a big part of the voter base.
certainly feels like we're just trying to slowly turn up the temperature until everything is still okay.
There are plenty examples of things done by gov't officials today that would've ben disqualifying 20 years ago. And I'm sure there are things viewed as 'crossing the line' today, that will be fine in 4 years. And that definitely scares me.
There are plenty examples of things done by gov't officials today that would've ben disqualifying 20 years ago. And I'm sure there are things viewed as 'crossing the line' today, that will be fine in 4 years. And that definitely scares me.
Keep an eye on SCOTUS. The executive is trying to unshackle itself from both the legislature and judiciary. Midterms might not matter.
I wish I had your confidence in our now-stacked Supreme Court. And military leadership.
> A real power-coup needs to be fast and decisive, and this group is instead just setting themselves up to get absolutely obliterated by the mid-terms in 16 months.
It's not like Trump et al were unknowns during the 2024 election and that their goals were hidden:
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025
People voted for them anyway. See "Why Do So Many People Think Trump Is Good?":
* https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/07/trump-admi...
* http://archive.is/https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/...
It's not like Trump et al were unknowns during the 2024 election and that their goals were hidden:
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025
People voted for them anyway. See "Why Do So Many People Think Trump Is Good?":
* https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/07/trump-admi...
* http://archive.is/https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/...
'[flagged]'. oh, ok. Well I guess we're at this point, then. We know where we're off to.
Funny, because even with an explicit (and patchily applied) ban on politics here on HN, this is a technology story. Polygraphs are inherently interesting.
But, ok, sure. Flagged.
Funny, because even with an explicit (and patchily applied) ban on politics here on HN, this is a technology story. Polygraphs are inherently interesting.
But, ok, sure. Flagged.
I've thought i watched a Louis Theroux documentary where they these used to on pedophiles to see if a therapy was working. I think i recall there being an issue as one of them put anti perspirant on his hands so test wouldn't work.
Saying that even if done correctly i'd be skeptical if it worked.
Saying that even if done correctly i'd be skeptical if it worked.
They don't work. You may as well use phrenology.
>You may as well use phrenology.
Don't give them ideas...
Don't give them ideas...
I mean 90% of my builds don't work but I haven't decided to abandon my computer to do coding.
Yeah but your failed builds aren't being used to falsely prosecute people I'd presume.
Did I miss some part of the article?
Anyone with a security clearance is subject to a polygraph exam at any time. Depending upon the sensitivity of what you do, it can typically be never, seven years, five years, or yearly. Each exam may consist of multiple sessions.
(I was cleared to a bunch of different stuff over 40 years, and I did not get my first polygraph until 30 years ago (about 13 years in). I was getting annual polygraphs for five years, then got them every five years for the remainder of my career.)
My circumstances were not typical, but five years is a typical cycle. It coincides with the "periodic re-investigation" interval, which can also be different, depending upon the nature of the clearances.
(I was cleared to a bunch of different stuff over 40 years, and I did not get my first polygraph until 30 years ago (about 13 years in). I was getting annual polygraphs for five years, then got them every five years for the remainder of my career.)
My circumstances were not typical, but five years is a typical cycle. It coincides with the "periodic re-investigation" interval, which can also be different, depending upon the nature of the clearances.
How many 'fealty to your boss' questions were you ever asked?
Subjects are informed that they are never to discuss or reveal details of their polygraph exam. Doing so could be prosecuted as a Title XVIII violation.
(Note: I don't agree with a lot of the mantra regarding the effectiveness of the polygraph. IMHO, the machine does nothing more than create an excuse for an interrogator to pressure the subject into confessing their wrongdoings. I've known a few sociopaths (including high-level security officers) who would pass with flying colors, because they were 100% comfortable with their lies.)
The (flagged) article tries to ridicule the current administration for enforcing the same policies that every previous administration has enforced: Obeying the orders and the rules.
(Note: I don't agree with a lot of the mantra regarding the effectiveness of the polygraph. IMHO, the machine does nothing more than create an excuse for an interrogator to pressure the subject into confessing their wrongdoings. I've known a few sociopaths (including high-level security officers) who would pass with flying colors, because they were 100% comfortable with their lies.)
The (flagged) article tries to ridicule the current administration for enforcing the same policies that every previous administration has enforced: Obeying the orders and the rules.
downvoted, there hasn't been a pervasive oath to loyalty in an administration in recent history. this is just bad defending of a horrible authoritarian.
And there likely isn't any sort of "oath" at all related to any polygraph. The poly isn't about signing agreements, it's about truthfully answering questions. The scope of the questions is different depending upon the agency and the clearance. The NYT is not an unbiased source. To quote the article:
"In interviews and polygraph tests, the F.B.I. has asked senior employees whether they have said anything negative about Mr. Patel, according to two people with knowledge of the questions and others familiar with similar accounts."
So this can be true and misleading at the same time. Some of the questions asked relate to social media activities and posts related to classified work. I can imagine a scenario where answering these questions would lead to a discussion about Kash Patel. Having a poor opinion of your boss while working in a classified environment could make a person more prone to leaking sensitive information. The FBI has been leaking like a sieve lately.
"In interviews and polygraph tests, the F.B.I. has asked senior employees whether they have said anything negative about Mr. Patel, according to two people with knowledge of the questions and others familiar with similar accounts."
So this can be true and misleading at the same time. Some of the questions asked relate to social media activities and posts related to classified work. I can imagine a scenario where answering these questions would lead to a discussion about Kash Patel. Having a poor opinion of your boss while working in a classified environment could make a person more prone to leaking sensitive information. The FBI has been leaking like a sieve lately.
They'll be bringing back Project Stargate next... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stargate_Project_(U.S._Army_un...
[deleted]
bradac56(5)
Personal loyalty tests.
You really shouldn’t be in any administrative role if you can’t handle criticism.