EBay Inc. Sells Equity Interest in Craigslist(ebayinc.com)
ebayinc.com
EBay Inc. Sells Equity Interest in Craigslist
http://www.ebayinc.com/node/7885
60 comments
I wonder if this deal is designed to make eBay an easier acquisition target for Amazon or Alibaba?
Very likely considering they've also split out PayPal to make eBay more of a single-focus entity (read, easy to sell off).
Craigslist has been in decline / shrinking for the last couple of years. I don't think it's a strong signal either way.
EDIT: see http://techcrunch.com/2015/04/10/as-vertical-marketplaces-ri...
EDIT: see http://techcrunch.com/2015/04/10/as-vertical-marketplaces-ri...
[citation needed]
Well, it's definitely less popular for people looking for random sex, what with smartphone apps and all. Not sure about other things.
I will tell you with very direct experience that their _monetized_ sections are growing quickly (due to more monetization in more cities), and the overall user base is growing with overall internet usage.
This needs citation also.
I don't have 3rd party research but I've been personally logging the names and locations of paid sections for the past two years.
This as well.
Highly doubt it. Getting rid of the legal uncertainty is minor plus but getting rid of a possibly 10 figure holding for much less than that is a large minus.
That would also explain the Kijiji-is-big-in-Canada submarines which have been appearing lately
eBay is also currently making product identifiers (UPC/EAN etc) compulsory, another step in a long line of steps to slowly turn themselves into something more like the amazon marketplace.
So is anyone going to recreate the ebay of yesteryear?
I guess the implication of eBay's shift (and the general demise of most C2C formal online "flea markets") is that it's not a great business to be in. There are probably a few factors at work.
- Arguably, there was something of a fad aspect to eBay's initial rise. Yes, there were serious buyers and sellers but I also suspect it was something of a game for a lot of people who subsequently moved on to do other things.
- In general, my sense is that buying/selling used goods is overall something that makes less sense today. That's a very broad brush statement but I've seen this directly in some areas with some local sports stores, for example, getting out of selling used gear.
- The overall broadening on the Internet population tends to mean that anywhere scammers can scam, they will. This is harder to effectively protect against in the type of market eBay originally focused on (one-off sales of pre-owned goods that were often not standard items).
- Arguably, there was something of a fad aspect to eBay's initial rise. Yes, there were serious buyers and sellers but I also suspect it was something of a game for a lot of people who subsequently moved on to do other things.
- In general, my sense is that buying/selling used goods is overall something that makes less sense today. That's a very broad brush statement but I've seen this directly in some areas with some local sports stores, for example, getting out of selling used gear.
- The overall broadening on the Internet population tends to mean that anywhere scammers can scam, they will. This is harder to effectively protect against in the type of market eBay originally focused on (one-off sales of pre-owned goods that were often not standard items).
As a very general trend, things are getting cheaper and time more expensive. Thus, the number of items that are worth reselling on eBay is shrinking.
Agreed. Every once in a while I consider selling something on eBay, think for a few seconds about the effort it would require to take different pictures, write up a compelling description, figure out shipping costs, find some decent packaging... ah whatever.
I love eBay as a buyer though, especially in Canada. There are still a ton of random things on there that really can't be found (at least not nearly as easily) anywhere else.
I love eBay as a buyer though, especially in Canada. There are still a ton of random things on there that really can't be found (at least not nearly as easily) anywhere else.
Amazon FBA is pretty awesome for this. You gather up all of the items you want to sell, set prices for each one, and then print shipping labels to ship them to Amazon. Everything after that is handled by Amazon (fulfillment, customer support, etc), and you are sent money.
Unfortunately this only really works for items already listed on Amazon - otherwise you need to create new listings.
Unfortunately this only really works for items already listed on Amazon - otherwise you need to create new listings.
You have to define whose time and what type of things but I'm in broad agreement. I know I haven't sold anything on eBay in ages and, even when I did, I found the ROI pretty poor. I also note that the various services offering to sell your stuff for a cut seem to be largely gone as well.
And I haven't bought anything through their traditional auction format in ages either. I don't really collect stuff and I'm not much inclined to do the auction thing when a few clicks at Amazon or Newegg will get me almost as good a deal (at minimum) for electronics for less hassle and risk.
And I haven't bought anything through their traditional auction format in ages either. I don't really collect stuff and I'm not much inclined to do the auction thing when a few clicks at Amazon or Newegg will get me almost as good a deal (at minimum) for electronics for less hassle and risk.
Regarding your second point, I expect that has more to do with the fact that it's difficult to compete with zero-overhead craigslist (and similar sites) for local used goods. There's little reason to use a B&M store to buy or sell such things used.
It still comes down to $$ vs. time. There's a lot of stuff I'd be happy to dump on a store at a theoretical 50 cents on the dollar vs. a private sale rather than dealing with a bunch of individual transactions. I might feel differently once transactions got into the hundreds of dollars but I don't generally want to deal with Craigslist or eBay for selling. Just too much trouble.
Ha, this is kind of the opposite of the ebay issue. I can totally see selling at a store for that reason. I even donate a lot of stuff I'm sure I could sell since it's just easier (and of course someone benefits). But as a buyer, it's going to be much easier to look around online, and most likely cheaper too, buying privately, than trying to buy from a B&M store.
I would really like to know what kind of return they made on their investment.
They bought the stake for $12 - 15m in 2004 when CraigsList sales were estimated at $7m/yr (1)
Today CL's sales are estimated to be ~$335m and doubled year-over-year (2)
(1) http://www.sfgate.com/business/article/EBay-buys-25-stake-in...
(2) http://www.wsj.com/articles/ebay-sells-craigslist-stake-back...
Today CL's sales are estimated to be ~$335m and doubled year-over-year (2)
(1) http://www.sfgate.com/business/article/EBay-buys-25-stake-in...
(2) http://www.wsj.com/articles/ebay-sells-craigslist-stake-back...
Craigslist has no advertising on their site and doesn't charge for listings except for a few small sections of the site in major metropolitan areas (the funds from which they use for their business expenses). I think it speaks to the state of the bubble we're in that one of the "blue chip" internet companies has a business model of "be an ultra-speculative investment as long as possible." Of course Amazon too, but I'd say Craigslist is a more extreme example.
This is coming from personal experience so take it with a grain of salt:
Craigslist is an insanely valuable source for lead generation in recruiting, and car sales.
I run a recruiting company and craigslist is the best source of applicants by volume and return on investment (cost ($) per applicant).
Having observed them closely, they are not ignorant to this fact.
When specific cities or sections grow more popular they begin charging fees.
Their biggest boon has been a recent change to charge car dealerships 5$ per post. Car dealers pay because only months earlier they were paying for black hat solutions to post for 1-2$ per post.
Craigslist is an insanely valuable source for lead generation in recruiting, and car sales.
I run a recruiting company and craigslist is the best source of applicants by volume and return on investment (cost ($) per applicant).
Having observed them closely, they are not ignorant to this fact.
When specific cities or sections grow more popular they begin charging fees.
Their biggest boon has been a recent change to charge car dealerships 5$ per post. Car dealers pay because only months earlier they were paying for black hat solutions to post for 1-2$ per post.
FWIW, if you ever watched hot girls wanted (a documentary film) you will learn that a lot of "porn stars" were recruited via craiglist. It was a very interesting documentary to see how many people would actually use craiglist to find opportunity.
Interesting - what candidates do you recruit using Craigslist?
We recruted an MIT graduate for a programming position via CL.
Honestly, I'm not interested in working for a place that doesn't use craigslist.
There was analysis recently of the 'on demand' players craigslist lead gen spend.
https://tryzen99.com/blog_posts/on-demand-is-in-demand
https://tryzen99.com/blog_posts/on-demand-is-in-demand
I was recruited to my first sysadmin/devops/etc. position through craigslist; similarly I encouraged a family member who quickly found a construction engineering position.
Sales positions. car sales, insurance sales, real estate sales.
chemists, sales persons, security, pilots... ;)
How can you say that in response to a comment saying that Craigslist made $335 MILLION and doubled revenue year over year? I mean sure perhaps dispute the underlying facts (they seem rock solid to me) but if making $335,000,000 in revenue is somehow the sign of a bubble then... i don't know what to say.
One is running ecommerce the other is running local commerce.
>except for a few small sections of the site in major metropolitan areas
Yeah... the most lucrative 20% of the volume...
Yeah... the most lucrative 20% of the volume...
Along those lines - when/if are they are they required to disclose it as a publicly-traded company?
I believe they are only required to disclose financials of it in their next quarterly update if the transaction has a "material" impact on the business. Which is open to a lot of interpretation but generally has come to mean that the information would have an impact on whether the average shareholder would buy or sell the stock.
This is why you see Apple buy dozens of companies quietly without disclosure all the time. Because most purchases would not really change whether the average person invests, if for no other reason than the sheer size of Apple.
This is why you see Apple buy dozens of companies quietly without disclosure all the time. Because most purchases would not really change whether the average person invests, if for no other reason than the sheer size of Apple.
Can someone please tell me why this matters?
For me it's the resolution to a very long piece of startup drama. As I recall it, an early CL employee got equity as a gift, and then sold it off in a way I thought disappointing:
http://web.archive.org/web/20040813165340/http://www.cnewmar...
EBay then launched a direct competitor, presumably using knowledge gained by being a major shareholder:
https://en.wikiphttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kijijiedia.org...
That also struck me as a shitty thing to do. Then eBay sued Craigslist and Craigslist sued eBay, causing further drama.
But now this is all over, and Craigslist can keep being Craigslist.
http://web.archive.org/web/20040813165340/http://www.cnewmar...
EBay then launched a direct competitor, presumably using knowledge gained by being a major shareholder:
https://en.wikiphttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kijijiedia.org...
That also struck me as a shitty thing to do. Then eBay sued Craigslist and Craigslist sued eBay, causing further drama.
But now this is all over, and Craigslist can keep being Craigslist.
http://pando.com/2015/06/19/pierre-omidyars-corporate-spying...
"""
Pierre Omidyar’s corporate spying scandal buried for good as eBay sells Craigslist stake
BY MARK AMES
ON JUNE 19, 2015
It didn’t get much attention, but eBay just quietly unloaded its 28.4 percent stake in Craigslist, putting to rest one of the most sordid episodes in Silicon Valley, in which eBay executives — including First Look Media publisher Pierre Omidyar and HP chief Meg Whitman — were directly implicated in corporate spying, stealing secrets, and exploiting Craigslist’s anti-capitalist idealism.
[...]
"""
"""
Pierre Omidyar’s corporate spying scandal buried for good as eBay sells Craigslist stake
BY MARK AMES
ON JUNE 19, 2015
It didn’t get much attention, but eBay just quietly unloaded its 28.4 percent stake in Craigslist, putting to rest one of the most sordid episodes in Silicon Valley, in which eBay executives — including First Look Media publisher Pierre Omidyar and HP chief Meg Whitman — were directly implicated in corporate spying, stealing secrets, and exploiting Craigslist’s anti-capitalist idealism.
[...]
"""
Wow, that is way worse than I thought. Disgusting.
> As I recall it, an early CL employee got equity as a gift, and then sold it off in a way I thought disappointing
To be fair, it's not like CL the company went out of their way to provide liquidity for that equity.
To be fair, it's not like CL the company went out of their way to provide liquidity for that equity.
It's fairly safe to say that it doesn't. The price wasn't announced, and does anyone here really care if eBay was suing Craigslist and vice versa? So it's a piece of financial news of interest to anyone following eBay's stock, but not really to anyone else.
I think the important part is that it ends litigation between the companies, so any acquisitions of either ebay or craigslist would be easier.
It gets rid of a tiny legal uncertainty. Much more significantly is that Ebay is apparently walking away from a massive financial gain and potentially even larger business gain by never having figured out any way to take advantage of Craigslist assets.
Interesting seeing eBay separate itself from these entities. First PayPal, now this. Are there others I'm missing?
eBay Enterprise is in the process of being sold or spun off:
http://recode.net/2015/01/21/ebay-to-cut-2400-jobs-and-explo...
Not many people know about eE, but it was the third pillar of eBay (alongside Marketplaces and Payments). It gives the sort of national merchants you find in malls the tools to compete with companies like Amazon. When Donahoe agreed to spin off PayPal, he promoted the head of Marketplaces (Devin Wenig) to be the CEO Elect of eBay Inc. Devin promptly announced he wanted to divest Enterprise, essentially splitting the 3 silos of eBay Inc into three separate companies.
http://recode.net/2015/01/21/ebay-to-cut-2400-jobs-and-explo...
Not many people know about eE, but it was the third pillar of eBay (alongside Marketplaces and Payments). It gives the sort of national merchants you find in malls the tools to compete with companies like Amazon. When Donahoe agreed to spin off PayPal, he promoted the head of Marketplaces (Devin Wenig) to be the CEO Elect of eBay Inc. Devin promptly announced he wanted to divest Enterprise, essentially splitting the 3 silos of eBay Inc into three separate companies.
Well, Stubhub would seem to be an obvious candidate. New management could make it much more profitable (e.g. add price floors like the other official resale marketplaces), but they would also face a potential avalanche of fraud cases they aren't prepared for.
There is also the Magento Enterprise division.
It would be so funny if EBay would finally be bought by Google.
Is Alibaba buying EBay?
[deleted]
Blog post on Craigslist's blog quoting Shakespeare.