How to go from Dev to PM(blog.geekli.st)
blog.geekli.st
How to go from Dev to PM
http://blog.geekli.st/post/69127121125/how-to-go-from-dev-to-pm-a-guest-blog-post-by-gayle
12 comments
"Article fails to explain why a dev would desire to become a PM."
(in most companies) more money, power, autonomy. Except in very early stage startups, it is the rare developer who has more of any of this than even the lowliest PM. e.g: I think Vic Gundotra makes more money, and has more power at Google than most (all?) engineers there.
(in most companies) more money, power, autonomy. Except in very early stage startups, it is the rare developer who has more of any of this than even the lowliest PM. e.g: I think Vic Gundotra makes more money, and has more power at Google than most (all?) engineers there.
I've never worked at a product company per se, but that is exactly why I aspired to transition into project management back when I worked in corporate IT. Can't blame folks for wanting the money and the power after they see how things are for the Vics in their companies.
This is not my experience. Companies with strong engineering organizations that are parallel with and equal to the product/business org structure would not have a product management bias. I would only work at a company where engineers are managed by other Engineers who are partners with the product and other business teams, not reporting to them. (I'm a Software Engineer).
I also think that engineers would be paid much better than product managers in such an organization, given the higher demand for engineering skills (there should be more engineers than product managers on any given team) and a smaller pool of potential hires.
I also think that engineers would be paid much better than product managers in such an organization, given the higher demand for engineering skills (there should be more engineers than product managers on any given team) and a smaller pool of potential hires.
I'm not sure this is true, at least in the current climate. At our (Series B) startup, PMs make about half what engineers do.
Not to discount your experience, but at the large enterprises (Amazon, Microsoft, Google, etc.), Program Managers make the same money as Software Developers at equivalent titles. Program Managers are not JIRA monkeys (I love JIRA, by the way), but generally have coded in the past and have a better grip on reality than some MBA candidates.
The tradeoff is this:
1) PMs get broader visibility across the org, which tends to result in faster promotions into management for "good" PMs.
2) PMs atrophy technical skills and become more dependent on the larger organization (they acquire more firm-specific skills in econ talk) than do equivalent developers.
So, sometimes if you like your company and want to advance quicker, you will be willing to trade away some industry or general skills for firm-specific skills to get faster promotions or more power.
The tradeoff is this:
1) PMs get broader visibility across the org, which tends to result in faster promotions into management for "good" PMs.
2) PMs atrophy technical skills and become more dependent on the larger organization (they acquire more firm-specific skills in econ talk) than do equivalent developers.
So, sometimes if you like your company and want to advance quicker, you will be willing to trade away some industry or general skills for firm-specific skills to get faster promotions or more power.
In all but small companies, I think devs have little to no contact with the other product/project stakeholders. For those devs who would like to be in a position to influence/interact with the stakeholders, being a PM would eliminate some of the constraints/WTFs devs often feel. Well, not always eliminate necessarily, but minimize them, or at least provide some transparency into the part(s) of decision-making process(es) outside the devs' sphere of influence.
I think because it trains you in skills that are relevant for a CEO or founder, whereas being a dev very often doesn't
I used to be a dev who transitioned to a PM and now am the CTO in my own startup. My main reason for becoming a PM was to get more customer contact and be in a position to make customer-focused product decisions. Someone mentioned that PMs make more money than devs, this is incorrect at least in most top tech companies. Compensation bands for PMs and Devs are the same.
Obviously the day-to-day work of a PM is pretty different from that of a dev and the transition is not something that all devs would like or should even aspire to. For those who want to know more about what PMs are supposed to do (and no, it is not just project management :-) check out my blog on this topic - http://avilay.wordpress.com/2013/07/03/what-does-a-pm-do/
Obviously the day-to-day work of a PM is pretty different from that of a dev and the transition is not something that all devs would like or should even aspire to. For those who want to know more about what PMs are supposed to do (and no, it is not just project management :-) check out my blog on this topic - http://avilay.wordpress.com/2013/07/03/what-does-a-pm-do/
great point avilay. thank you for helping clarify the difference between the two PM's. product vs project. i think this is an important differentiation and one which, when clarified, could help more developers excel in their careers without losing their coding edge.
Ugh. Don't do it. Someone find me an article on how to go from PM back to dev.
Most PMs don't have the chops and just enjoy a job thats less grunt-worky. They usually don't have a choice. I seriously doubt anyone with real programming chops would be happy being an overseer rather than an architect.
I've worked with several PMs who had technical chops.
Note that not everyone who has the chops necessarily love programming. Also, as others pointed out, in many companies a PM earns more than any technical person.
Note that not everyone who has the chops necessarily love programming. Also, as others pointed out, in many companies a PM earns more than any technical person.
As a curiosity:
Are you really stuck in meetings and infantile email disputes as long as it looks like from a devs POV? This is coming from personal observation of my work environment, not any sort of dig at you.
I've always assumed that a single PM is good, but as soon as you put two together, work grinds to a halt.
note: our PM's make about 30k more than the highest paid dev.
Are you really stuck in meetings and infantile email disputes as long as it looks like from a devs POV? This is coming from personal observation of my work environment, not any sort of dig at you.
I've always assumed that a single PM is good, but as soon as you put two together, work grinds to a halt.
note: our PM's make about 30k more than the highest paid dev.
Even my hair feels different!
(from dev to PHB)
(from dev to PHB)
No offense ... But this proposition doesn't sound very appealing at all ... I love how with hard work and determination, mastering technical knowledge, you too can become a middling middle managing bean counter too ... :) Perhaps that is a bit harsh but ... I dunno.
A good PM is an great asset that adds huge value to a company. Most are middling middle managing bean counters.
Advice on how to make sure you become the former and not the later would be more useful than this blog post.
Advice on how to make sure you become the former and not the later would be more useful than this blog post.
I think the real problem is the company you work for as a PM. What kind of projects you are working on, who is actually holding the purse strings, who the clients are (internally or externally) etc.
I know project managers who are boss hog and ones who are little more than account managers with a title.
TINSTAAFL.
These articles are almost as bad as the "how to become a CEO." First answer, why? Because of the desire for power over others? Weak, lame, not in the spirit of being a hacker. Flat management everyone, screw the PMs. Where's the book on how to bury your PM 6 feet deep?
I worked for a company with 250 people and only 4 "layers" from top to bottom. My project still had team leaders and a project manager, and believe me all of them would rather have been coding than managing.
Take some management classes.
I'm not saying you have to take an MBA, but being able to code and being able to manage people are not the same talent. In many situations, they're quite the opposite.
And you had to show off your coding cred before being hired for it. The same should apply for management.
I'm not saying you have to take an MBA, but being able to code and being able to manage people are not the same talent. In many situations, they're quite the opposite.
And you had to show off your coding cred before being hired for it. The same should apply for management.
Additionally, being able to code and being able to manage people and being able to manage products/projects are all different skill sets.
I'm not disagreeing, but can you explain under which situations coding and managing are on the opposite parts of the spectrum?
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Pretty much all aspects.
Have you ever sworn at your computer?
As a result of swearing at your computer did it refuse to work for you the next day?
Have you ever had to bring your computer into an office sit it down and ask it to come in earlier even though you don't really care what time it shows up?
Have you ever had to defend your computer making a typo and costing the company $100,000 to people who are so careless as to ignore the redlines under their misspelled words in the email regarding this issue?
As a manager you are a human shit shield for the people beneath you. In addition to being a human shit shield whenever the budget is cut you must pick who gets a paycheque and who doesn't when the budget is cut. At the end of the day after letting people go, you toss a coin walk into your managers office and then find out if you made the cut.
The only really good thing about being a manager is that when comically stupid decisions get made all you have to do is keep a straight face and delegate actually implementing it to someone instead of having to code the atrocity yourself.
Have you ever sworn at your computer?
As a result of swearing at your computer did it refuse to work for you the next day?
Have you ever had to bring your computer into an office sit it down and ask it to come in earlier even though you don't really care what time it shows up?
Have you ever had to defend your computer making a typo and costing the company $100,000 to people who are so careless as to ignore the redlines under their misspelled words in the email regarding this issue?
As a manager you are a human shit shield for the people beneath you. In addition to being a human shit shield whenever the budget is cut you must pick who gets a paycheque and who doesn't when the budget is cut. At the end of the day after letting people go, you toss a coin walk into your managers office and then find out if you made the cut.
The only really good thing about being a manager is that when comically stupid decisions get made all you have to do is keep a straight face and delegate actually implementing it to someone instead of having to code the atrocity yourself.
golf clap
I'd totally grab her book if it wasn't almost $40. Cracking the Coding Interview was amazingly helpful during my job search.
How does one overcome the Peter Principle?
In a previous job, the "title" came after you actually performed well in that job and your current job. Worked pretty well most of the time. For anyone aspiring to start their own company, being a Product (not Project) Manager does make some sense as you get to tackle real problems with someone else's money.
I see many points about not wanting to manage being mentioned, but if you read into it more you'll find Gayle is suggesting this is about developers who want to drive product. Product Management is much more than just management roles and I know many coders who do product management while maintaining their coding space. It's not for everyone, but Product Management is not project management.
Anyone else confused by "PM"? I assume the author means Product Manager, but I'm not certain.
Yes, it's Product Manager, as in the guy who is responsible for deciding what the team is going to build.
A lot of the replies here seem to be castigating the role of a Project Manager, which is the often technically clueless PHB type responsible for ensuring that a waterfall project is completed by its deadline.
A lot of the replies here seem to be castigating the role of a Project Manager, which is the often technically clueless PHB type responsible for ensuring that a waterfall project is completed by its deadline.
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Edit: I imagine that's perfectly natural - when I was in backoffice IT I strongly desired to transition into project management so that I could transition into people management so that I could make meaningful decisions and get credit for them. It's probably the same in product companies except low-level devs will want to manage products so they can manage divisions so they can run big-name tech companies. Currently I'm working as a consulting dev in a small dev consultancy and I don't feel the same pull in that direction that I used to. I think maybe all we really need is to be taken seriously and to have some meaningful work.