Ask HN - I just left my job today and I'm really confused. Need urgent advice
17 comments
Yes, you need to show up tomorrow. Also: in the future, when you have a conversation about when you plan to leave the company and someone asks what date you'd like to go, pick a date 2 weeks into the future. You probably didn't intend to refuse 2 weeks notice, but your reply could have been misinterpreted. If your employer doesn't need/want you to stay for the 2 weeks, they'll tell you.
From this point on: stop spending cycles thinking about how your ex-employer is treating you, and stop feeling sorry for yourself about that treatment. It's over. Companies often have standard policies that kick in when people give notice which include cutting off all your accounts. Those practices will feel rude to you, but it's best not to take them personally.
Your goal at this point is to be as valuable to the team as you can be (regardless of how you're treated by the company). That's because leaving the best possible impression of yourself with the largest number of people at your ex-employer is the only valuable outcome left for you at the job.
Good luck with your next job. You're in a great market, and if you don't like your current employer, moving on is the right decision.
From this point on: stop spending cycles thinking about how your ex-employer is treating you, and stop feeling sorry for yourself about that treatment. It's over. Companies often have standard policies that kick in when people give notice which include cutting off all your accounts. Those practices will feel rude to you, but it's best not to take them personally.
Your goal at this point is to be as valuable to the team as you can be (regardless of how you're treated by the company). That's because leaving the best possible impression of yourself with the largest number of people at your ex-employer is the only valuable outcome left for you at the job.
Good luck with your next job. You're in a great market, and if you don't like your current employer, moving on is the right decision.
If it were me, I'd show up as planned.
Remember, you're the professional here. They're the company with the crazy project manager that flipped out on you for working the hours you agreed to work when you were hired. The rest of the company is still fine in your opinion, and you're on similarly good terms with the rest of the dev team and management. If they give you any grief, it's them behaving badly.
Incidentally, if they do want you to come back to help with knowledge transfer, you'll be quoting your day rate for consulting. This is not going to be less than $1,000 per day (or fraction thereof), and will be double that if you were anything other than a junior dev.
Good luck. Let us know four days from now when you've landed your next gig for more money!
Remember, you're the professional here. They're the company with the crazy project manager that flipped out on you for working the hours you agreed to work when you were hired. The rest of the company is still fine in your opinion, and you're on similarly good terms with the rest of the dev team and management. If they give you any grief, it's them behaving badly.
Incidentally, if they do want you to come back to help with knowledge transfer, you'll be quoting your day rate for consulting. This is not going to be less than $1,000 per day (or fraction thereof), and will be double that if you were anything other than a junior dev.
Good luck. Let us know four days from now when you've landed your next gig for more money!
Go and try to make the best impression on everyone else there.
Be friendly open. Tell people you will miss working with them. Appreciate their good work. Try to leave with a good impression.
You are essentially leaving because the PM doesn't know what he want and can't judge actions of other people.
In best case he will play the role of the grumpy/stressed PM. In worst case he will try to control each step you take that day. Both is fine for you.
Try to understand it from his point of view. Most likely the team grew to fast and is now rushing into something they do not really understand, most likely are unsure about or have doubts on funding/survival/etc. His actions sound like he is simply scared. Sooner or later you will meet again and see everything from a different light.
If they ask you about future "quick calls" etc instantly agree on a hourly rate you are comfortable with.
With all that said and done. Leave with a smile on your face. From this point on you have nothing to loose and can only gain.
Be friendly open. Tell people you will miss working with them. Appreciate their good work. Try to leave with a good impression.
You are essentially leaving because the PM doesn't know what he want and can't judge actions of other people.
In best case he will play the role of the grumpy/stressed PM. In worst case he will try to control each step you take that day. Both is fine for you.
Try to understand it from his point of view. Most likely the team grew to fast and is now rushing into something they do not really understand, most likely are unsure about or have doubts on funding/survival/etc. His actions sound like he is simply scared. Sooner or later you will meet again and see everything from a different light.
If they ask you about future "quick calls" etc instantly agree on a hourly rate you are comfortable with.
With all that said and done. Leave with a smile on your face. From this point on you have nothing to loose and can only gain.
The best way to kill douchebags is by overwhelming them with kindness.
Go there, be nice, enjoy the last moments with the collegues you like, and don't blame anyone. I feel like he is the idiot here, so be twice as gentle with him as you are with the others.
Make him look like the guy he is in front of the others, by being nice :).
Enjoy your final check, go home and think about your next steps :).
Good luck
Go there, be nice, enjoy the last moments with the collegues you like, and don't blame anyone. I feel like he is the idiot here, so be twice as gentle with him as you are with the others.
Make him look like the guy he is in front of the others, by being nice :).
Enjoy your final check, go home and think about your next steps :).
Good luck
This seems more than petty childish behavior to me. This might sound very much out there, but for the sake of argument, just hear me out.
Are you sure your company isn't downsizing? All of his actions so far point to the possibility that he (the company?) wanted you to quit. And if he (they) did want you to quit, he (they) could have given you the pink slip?
The most obvious question that follows is, why you. Well, you did say you joined them recently, so there's less to worry about the knowledge transfer. Maybe they want to save on the severance package? Maybe they want to do it quietly without spreading panic?
The whole thing seems a bit suspicious to me. If you choose not to investigate, just make sure you deal with it professionally - see vishaldpatel's response [1].
A part of me tells me that you may just have dodged a bullet. Good luck for your future. :)
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5951062
Are you sure your company isn't downsizing? All of his actions so far point to the possibility that he (the company?) wanted you to quit. And if he (they) did want you to quit, he (they) could have given you the pink slip?
The most obvious question that follows is, why you. Well, you did say you joined them recently, so there's less to worry about the knowledge transfer. Maybe they want to save on the severance package? Maybe they want to do it quietly without spreading panic?
The whole thing seems a bit suspicious to me. If you choose not to investigate, just make sure you deal with it professionally - see vishaldpatel's response [1].
A part of me tells me that you may just have dodged a bullet. Good luck for your future. :)
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5951062
He is probably trying to humiliate you by having you come in and at the same time take all your access. You should go in however if he crosses the line escalate the issue politely to his boss asking what you should do when you have resigned and he wants you to come in but have nothing for you to do.
Remember its a two way street. May be your are young or don't know what to do and he senses that and he is just taking advantage of your situation. I would also talk to a lawyer and see what your options are. At the end don't be afraid to act (polite but strong) otherwise the regret will stay with you.
Good luck
Remember its a two way street. May be your are young or don't know what to do and he senses that and he is just taking advantage of your situation. I would also talk to a lawyer and see what your options are. At the end don't be afraid to act (polite but strong) otherwise the regret will stay with you.
Good luck
I saw your post last night but was too tired to respond and apparently I am too late now.
As some of the others have stated, be the professional one here. As a PM - he/she/it sounds to be fairly awful but I haven't walked a mile in their shoes so it's hard to judge. It does sound like there's trouble in paradise there... As fun as it is to fantasize about the "Fk you, Fk you, I like you, Fk you..." scene it doesn't benefit you ever. I was at very similar situation at my first job. It was a very similar situation but I saw the handwriting on the wall and I found a new job. Shortly after I left they started offering early retirement and then eventually they started the layoffs.
As some of the others have stated, be the professional one here. As a PM - he/she/it sounds to be fairly awful but I haven't walked a mile in their shoes so it's hard to judge. It does sound like there's trouble in paradise there... As fun as it is to fantasize about the "Fk you, Fk you, I like you, Fk you..." scene it doesn't benefit you ever. I was at very similar situation at my first job. It was a very similar situation but I saw the handwriting on the wall and I found a new job. Shortly after I left they started offering early retirement and then eventually they started the layoffs.
Just go. The PM asked you to come in, so it is on him. Disabling your email isn't out of line, as they want you to not receive any more official company email at this point
It's best practice to immediately lock someone out from all accounts if they are leaving on bad terms. You don't want them to be sending nasty emails to customers or to delete company data. It almost never happens but sometimes someone snaps and creates a big mess.
You should come and maybe bring something nice for the people you enjoyed working with. Make sure you have a talk with the project managers boss and tell him why you are leaving. Furthermore you should act professional so don't involve your colleagues. It's nasty but it's between you, him and his boss. Your colleagues will figure it out anyway.
Best of luck finding a new job!
You should come and maybe bring something nice for the people you enjoyed working with. Make sure you have a talk with the project managers boss and tell him why you are leaving. Furthermore you should act professional so don't involve your colleagues. It's nasty but it's between you, him and his boss. Your colleagues will figure it out anyway.
Best of luck finding a new job!
You should go in to collect your final check. Also, if they'd like to hire you for knowledge transfer, then have a consulting rate and arrangement that you'd be comfortable with in mind. Keep it professional.
You should go and wrap things up. The day will be short, but if you can get the formalities out of the way, it'll make things smoother. Get your final check, and if you've vested any shares, ensure you have documentation that outlines what you hold. Then leave the place with a smile on your face and a genuinely good attitude; there's nothing in it for either you or them to have bad blood after you've gone.
Just don't touch anything. Go to the company and finish the leaving process. Anything you may try to do in the system can be seen as a problem.
This does happen occasionally. Could be a paranoid exec or just an IT guy who has vacation planned tomorrow so he turned your accounts off tonight. Just go and be nice. Don't air your grievances, it will only make you look bad and everyone else is probably aware of the problems anyway. You made the right decision - things rarely get better. Trust your gut.
I would not say this was 'paranoid' behaviour, but rather standard operations procedure. Leaving access to email accounts after someone has been let go is just asking for a nasty email sent to all contacts.
As I thought yesterday, the PM is a dick. And I say this as a PM, I'm not biassed against them :-)
In these situations, people don't remember what happened, but they will remember how you reacted. Be super nice and professional, so that everyone is left wondering "Geez, why did we let him go?"
In these situations, people don't remember what happened, but they will remember how you reacted. Be super nice and professional, so that everyone is left wondering "Geez, why did we let him go?"
No way would I go if it's 80 minutes. That is like $25 to get down there and back. Why travel down there only to be not allowed in the building? I usually stick all the keys and crap in a letter size envelope and mail it.
Go, they should have your final check waiting for you.
Make no apologies and admit no wrong doing.
Today after speaking with him again, he showed very little willingness to discuss anything, and simply cut me off and repeated the same accusations he made yesterday. I decided that there was no longer any reason for me to stay, so I gave notice by the end of the day.
He asked me when I wanted to leave, and I said today as I had already spoken to the only other dev on my team and committed and pushed all my code along with documentation I wanted to leave for the other dev. He threatened (implied) that "people" would be pissed if I didn't come in tomorrow, so I agreed to go tomorrow for knowledge transfer.
However, 3 hours ago, he removed all access from my Basecamp, Bitbucket, and Trello accounts. I know because I checked the company GMail to make sure he didn't suddenly send an email telling me I didn't need to go. Just now, I tried to check company email again, but it was disabled. My impression is that at the very least, my email should not be disabled until I am completely "gone". I'm not sure if this is standard practice, but now I am not sure if I should still be showing up tomorrow. I feel like I will arrive with my key disabled after 1 hour and 20 minutes of commute.
Any advice/suggestions would be much appreciated. It is 11:46PM here in Vancouver so I really don't know what I am supposed to do.
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5942912