My app has to dodge around government regulation. It shouldn’t have to.(blog.untogether.co.uk)
blog.untogether.co.uk
My app has to dodge around government regulation. It shouldn’t have to.
http://blog.untogether.co.uk/post/18383101195/my-app-has-to-dodge-around-government-regulation-it
11 comments
"Looser immigration policies. If your IQ's above 130, you get in. If you have a graduate degree, you get in."
Many serial killers have high IQs and there are many average-IQ people without graduate degrees that still deserve a chance at a better life. Some of the smartest people have done some of the worst things in human history.
Frankly, I'm sick of this elitist point-of-view.
Many serial killers have high IQs and there are many average-IQ people without graduate degrees that still deserve a chance at a better life. Some of the smartest people have done some of the worst things in human history.
Frankly, I'm sick of this elitist point-of-view.
> Many serial killers have high IQs and there are many average-IQ people without graduate degrees that still deserve a chance at a better life. Some of the smartest people have done some of the worst things in human history.
Irrelevant. I'm looking for simple, cheap, easy wins, without a lot of administration. If you're smart, letting you into the country is probably an easy win. I'm not saying scrap the existing immigration system, just have these extra holes in it.
Irrelevant. I'm looking for simple, cheap, easy wins, without a lot of administration. If you're smart, letting you into the country is probably an easy win. I'm not saying scrap the existing immigration system, just have these extra holes in it.
"If you're smart, letting you into the country is probably an easy win."
Many smart people waste away in academia and don't contribute very much to the economy. I know a lot of smart people that are doing absolutely nothing with their life.
It's not a very good determining factor for an "easy win".
Many smart people waste away in academia and don't contribute very much to the economy. I know a lot of smart people that are doing absolutely nothing with their life.
It's not a very good determining factor for an "easy win".
IQ's above 130
That's been tried and it's not the best part of our history. I know you mean well with this point and I agree with your larger argument, but there's a sad backstory about the rather fundamentally flawed IQ system and the eugenics movement. (As in, "let's sterilize the stupid and non-English-speaking people.")
That's been tried and it's not the best part of our history. I know you mean well with this point and I agree with your larger argument, but there's a sad backstory about the rather fundamentally flawed IQ system and the eugenics movement. (As in, "let's sterilize the stupid and non-English-speaking people.")
...how are these things related?
Which things? IQ and eugenics? Or low IQ scores and not having English as a first language (as IQ was measured in the 30's)? Or IQ and immigration quotas that favored Northern Europe over Southern Europe?
I meant eugenics and using IQ as one way of streamlining the immigration process.
Ah. They're related historically. 1930's.
Note that I did specifically mention that I was only talking about this one way of streamlining the immigration process and that I agree with you on the whole. But I think perception of your point will be marred by mention of IQ as a criterion. Look it up.
Note that I did specifically mention that I was only talking about this one way of streamlining the immigration process and that I agree with you on the whole. But I think perception of your point will be marred by mention of IQ as a criterion. Look it up.
To attempt to clear up some confusion that has arisen in the discussion here: it wasn't my intention to come across as someone whining about how the government is ruining my idea. It isn't- as I mentioned in the article, I have plenty of avenues available to me. But yes, my life would be easier if the law were different.
My larger point was that most startups simply don't have the time or resources to dedicate to lobbying governments of any type for change, so instead we just have to dodge around our problems. That puts us behind the giant corporations who bend the law to their will.
My larger point was that most startups simply don't have the time or resources to dedicate to lobbying governments of any type for change, so instead we just have to dodge around our problems. That puts us behind the giant corporations who bend the law to their will.
As I said, an individual startup doesn't have the resources, but collectively we can -- and absolutely should -- find ways to get these laws changed.
The app I've been working on is held back by what I believe to be outdated thinking. I'd be interested to know what other HNers think about fixing something like this- is it even possible? Worth the effort?
You are being held back by the rent-seekers who benefit from the current laws. It's not about outdated thinking.
This is the part I don't follow - who benefits from this? Yellow Cab? How? It seems like "easier communication between service seekers and service providers" would be a win for everybody.
This is not necessarily a win for everybody.
I can foresee a situation where cabs start to favor only bookings/hailings from this app, since the fares (i.e. people getting into the cab) clearly have money (since they have a smartphone) and will hopefully tip better.
The rest of us schmucks trying to hail a cab the old-fashioned way will be out of luck, since all the cabs will be waiting to pick up a smartphone fare.
I can foresee a situation where cabs start to favor only bookings/hailings from this app, since the fares (i.e. people getting into the cab) clearly have money (since they have a smartphone) and will hopefully tip better.
The rest of us schmucks trying to hail a cab the old-fashioned way will be out of luck, since all the cabs will be waiting to pick up a smartphone fare.
The Water Club on the East Side and whatever they are calling that restaurant in Central Park these days, have a light that they turn on away from the restaurant proper where it is more visible to the road signaling that a patron needs a taxi.
Less usefully, but along the same lines you still see doorman blowing whistles to try and get taxis to come down a side street.
I'm not sure how this translates into a solution for your problem, but I think you need to consider some hybrid meatspace / internet mechanism.
Less usefully, but along the same lines you still see doorman blowing whistles to try and get taxis to come down a side street.
I'm not sure how this translates into a solution for your problem, but I think you need to consider some hybrid meatspace / internet mechanism.
Care to provide more detail?
"Outdated thinking" might mean NIMBY nuke plant aversion, or it might mean infant cannibalism--without providing more information we have no idea what you're talking about.
"Outdated thinking" might mean NIMBY nuke plant aversion, or it might mean infant cannibalism--without providing more information we have no idea what you're talking about.
Well.. the detail is in the article linked. I'm the author.
For a TL;DR: you can't book yellow cabs in New York- the only way to get one is by hailing one on the street. I think that is an outdated and inefficient method, and think that there ought to be change.
For a TL;DR: you can't book yellow cabs in New York- the only way to get one is by hailing one on the street. I think that is an outdated and inefficient method, and think that there ought to be change.
That doesn't sound right.. You can book a yellow cab through a dispatcher. This happens at bars all the time.
There is even an online service and app which claims to do it: http://itaxinyc.com/ (competitor to you?)
There is even an online service and app which claims to do it: http://itaxinyc.com/ (competitor to you?)
I've not seen those guys before, and haven't investigated in depth but all their booking options are for private livery cab services- not yellow cabs. I'm not sure about booking from bars, etc., but I've certainly not seen it.
There's nothing wrong with those services- indeed, as I mention in the article, it's likely the route my app will go down. But there are a lot of yellow cabs, and not being able to include them is a real shame.
There's nothing wrong with those services- indeed, as I mention in the article, it's likely the route my app will go down. But there are a lot of yellow cabs, and not being able to include them is a real shame.
Ah, you are right.. "For-Hire vehicles" are different from "medallion taxis". I've spent the past hour reading the rules on the T&LC site. (This stuff kinda interests me because I'm a consultant for the NYC Department of Law). T&LC even has specific publications regarding smartphone apps like what you are developing.
NYC has really gone to great lengths to protect the existing medallion system - no surprise given the amount of money that it brings in.
NYC has really gone to great lengths to protect the existing medallion system - no surprise given the amount of money that it brings in.
NYC has really gone to great lengths to protect the existing medallion system - no surprise given the amount of money that it brings in.
I think that's probably the core of it, yes. At the end of the day, it isn't a problem for me to use for-hire taxi services- it's just a shame that I can't use yellow cabs.
I didn't really intend for this post to be a complaint about government regulation- it exists everywhere, and often for good reason- but more about the fact that the average startup has no time to lobby government for change.
I think that's probably the core of it, yes. At the end of the day, it isn't a problem for me to use for-hire taxi services- it's just a shame that I can't use yellow cabs.
I didn't really intend for this post to be a complaint about government regulation- it exists everywhere, and often for good reason- but more about the fact that the average startup has no time to lobby government for change.
You can request nearby drivers with taxi-like services, such as Uber: https://www.uber.com/
Edit: Hurp durp, you mentioned Uber in your post. Ignore me :)
Edit: Hurp durp, you mentioned Uber in your post. Ignore me :)
I like your app, BUT :
1. You have not done your homework on the market before creating it, if you want to monetize it you should have and you probably should have targeted Europe where it's legal to book a cab.
2. How do you convince your app users that it's better to use the app than to call? App is free, calling costs - may work, may not. App needs internet, calling does not. That's where marketing comes in.
Don't try to find guilty, try to find how to fix it.
Good Luck.
To be clear: I did my homework, I knew the situation when I started, and I'm not trying to find the government guilty of anything, other than natural inertia.
As I said in the post, it's perfectly legal to book a private car service in New York. So it's not like the idea is a lost cause- I just have to work with private car services. What I'm saying is that having to exclude yellow cabs is a disadvantage to me, the yellow cab drivers, and passengers. Forcing people to stand out on street corners is not very forward-thinking.
As I said in the post, it's perfectly legal to book a private car service in New York. So it's not like the idea is a lost cause- I just have to work with private car services. What I'm saying is that having to exclude yellow cabs is a disadvantage to me, the yellow cab drivers, and passengers. Forcing people to stand out on street corners is not very forward-thinking.
Forcing people to stand out on street corners is not very forward-thinking.
But it is democratic, since everyone has an equal chance at hailing a cab.
But it is democratic, since everyone has an equal chance at hailing a cab.
I think you forgot the smiley face. Well, I hope you forgot the smiley face.
Democratic principles shouldn't be blindly applied to every possible situtation in pursuit of an über-equality utopia.
Democratic principles shouldn't be blindly applied to every possible situtation in pursuit of an über-equality utopia.
If the yellow cab drivers have phones on them as well, you could try to make "psuedo hails" using bluetooth or something where if you drive by a taxono.my user who has hailed a cab both apps ping, and let the users know. Then you could just have the drivers app show a heatmap of hails throughout the city to get them in the right places.
Or. Operate the startup outside of the country in question. Regulations be damned. Innovate first. Ask forgiveness later. Be noisy about governments trying to squash innovation in the press. They hate that.
Why can't you just push the location of people needing a taxi to all the cabs, rather than pushing it to a specific one? Would that still be considered a booking?
Well Ron Paul is the solution right there - No government and regulation tyranny. research..
Stop asking for permission, start begging for forgiveness.
You can't "book" a cab from your app?
Fine, put a button to 'call' the cab.
You can't "book" in advance, use the data from your app to guess the time someone should call in advance to have a cab for when they need it, then send them an alert to make that call, along with aforementioned link.
You mention livery services for "booking" when a user needs something booked send them to a livery service.
There are a million solutions to your problems, you just have to find them. Also, avoid jurisdictions with regulations contrary to your business model.
You can't "book" a cab from your app?
Fine, put a button to 'call' the cab.
You can't "book" in advance, use the data from your app to guess the time someone should call in advance to have a cab for when they need it, then send them an alert to make that call, along with aforementioned link.
You mention livery services for "booking" when a user needs something booked send them to a livery service.
There are a million solutions to your problems, you just have to find them. Also, avoid jurisdictions with regulations contrary to your business model.
Not sure how it works in the UK, but you can always sue over a law in the US if you really disagree with it and have a good reason for why it doesn't make sense. That's what we're doing.
Well as some one once told me "In some bits of America its still a bit like that" And in Chicago its "a Lot Like that"
What I think (and ime not going to be popular here) the USA needs is to totaly reorganise local govement far to may things are decided at too low a level for a modern and efficient state.
This meens radicaly doing away with "states rights" it makes no sense to have multiple sales and local income taxes - think how much monney would be saved by having a single sales tax.
What I think (and ime not going to be popular here) the USA needs is to totaly reorganise local govement far to may things are decided at too low a level for a modern and efficient state.
This meens radicaly doing away with "states rights" it makes no sense to have multiple sales and local income taxes - think how much monney would be saved by having a single sales tax.
The problem here is that the local government is being too inflexible--that's not to say, however, that a higher-level one would be any better. I assure you, the problems in getting a federal change of policy--were it necessary--are far in excess of figuring out a city.
If the market really cared enough, they could likely sway the local government. If the product was good enough to justify that, then it would likely happen. Any failings thus probably stem from some mismatch in market and product.
If the market really cared enough, they could likely sway the local government. If the product was good enough to justify that, then it would likely happen. Any failings thus probably stem from some mismatch in market and product.
If the market really cared enough, they could likely sway the local government. If the product was good enough to justify that, then it would likely happen.
What/who is "the market", though? You can't really get traction behind an idea that is impossible to demonstrate. Users could get passionate about a useful service that is taken away from them, but it's a lot more difficult to get anyone passionate about something they've never had, and can't try.
What/who is "the market", though? You can't really get traction behind an idea that is impossible to demonstrate. Users could get passionate about a useful service that is taken away from them, but it's a lot more difficult to get anyone passionate about something they've never had, and can't try.
Getting a single US city to change it's regulations is easier than changing federal regulations.
Getting 1/3 of all US city's to change a regulation is a lot harder than changing federal regulations.
Operating a national organization that follows hundreds of independent regulations is harder than a cohesive federal regulation.
Operating a national organization that follows hundreds of independent regulations is harder than a cohesive federal regulation.
We need a lobby to push for:
liberalized IP policy, including 28-year copyrights, an end to software patents, penalties for introducing frivolous copyright suits, an end to anti-circumvention, etc.
Looser immigration policies. If your IQ's above 130, you get in. If you have a graduate degree, you get in. If you've started a successful company before, you get in.
And mitigation of various kinds of red tape and local regulation like this.
A lobby like this would help to create a more vibrant, more productive startup community, and so ideally, the firms that benefit from same, especially the VC firms, would cooperate to fund it.
We can talk all we want about getting the money out of politics, but until that's done, I think we need to play ball. This is how things get done. This is how we get what we all want.