It Gets Better: Google Employees(youtube.com)
youtube.com
It Gets Better: Google Employees
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYLs4NCgvNU&feature=player_embedded
11 comments
I've been feeling pretty down today about my thread being killed, wondering whether I had made some sort of mistake by posting it. However, this thread, and watching the Google Video, both have made me feel a lot better. Thanks for the supportive words. :)
I'm really sorry that thread got killed. I thought it was great, and I was really disappointed too. I'm glad you're here and I'm glad you posted it, and I hope this community gets better.
> I'm quite disappointed that the discussion about gay founders was shot down
I really hope this hacker community isn't split on lines of gender, sexual orientation, nationality, age, dietary, operating system or language preferences. We should be supportive.
I really hope this hacker community isn't split on lines of gender, sexual orientation, nationality, age, dietary, operating system or language preferences. We should be supportive.
Despite being one of the commenters you mentioned, I agree with you that the discussion should not have been killed.
It was properly shut down because most people here don't precieve it as an issue at all. Of course a gay person is welcome in this community, just as a blond person is - it is a complete non-issue.
For context, sex and relationship columnist Dan Savage started this initiative to spread hope to LGBT teens struggling through what can be a hard time in their lives. From the youtube channel:
"Billy Lucas was just 15 when he hanged himself in a barn on his grandmother's property. He reportedly endured intense bullying at the hands of his classmates—classmates who called him a fag and told him to kill himself. His mother found his body.... I wish I could have talked to this kid for five minutes. I wish I could have told Billy that it gets better. I wish I could have told him that, however bad things were, however isolated and alone he was, it gets better.
"Billy Lucas was just 15 when he hanged himself in a barn on his grandmother's property. He reportedly endured intense bullying at the hands of his classmates—classmates who called him a fag and told him to kill himself. His mother found his body.... I wish I could have talked to this kid for five minutes. I wish I could have told Billy that it gets better. I wish I could have told him that, however bad things were, however isolated and alone he was, it gets better.
It gets better.
For most people, not just LGBT teens. Highschool is a weird anomaly really, inside there's one set of rules for what's good, what's important, and who's popular. But when you get outside you realize it was all crap. Being popular in high school earns you nothing in real life. Noone outside cares about what was important in high school.
Instead, you realize that the ones that were smart, that got good grades, that worked hard at the actual schoolwork, that got bullied, they're the ones doing pretty well in life.
It's kinda funny, because when you're inside, teachers and adults are saying this, but noone listens. I think that's the larger problem: why is highschool so incredibly disconnected from reality?
For most people, not just LGBT teens. Highschool is a weird anomaly really, inside there's one set of rules for what's good, what's important, and who's popular. But when you get outside you realize it was all crap. Being popular in high school earns you nothing in real life. Noone outside cares about what was important in high school.
Instead, you realize that the ones that were smart, that got good grades, that worked hard at the actual schoolwork, that got bullied, they're the ones doing pretty well in life.
It's kinda funny, because when you're inside, teachers and adults are saying this, but noone listens. I think that's the larger problem: why is highschool so incredibly disconnected from reality?
Highschool is a weird anomaly really, inside there's one set of rules for what's good, what's important, and who's popular. But when you get outside you realize it was all crap. Being popular in high school earns you nothing in real life. Noone outside cares about what was important in high school.
Except... Work at a company that has more than a handful of people. Who is the PM, the VP of sales, the product manager? Creative is mad at engineering because they have to redo all the graphics to make room for a new javascirpt dropdown. The tech exec meeting has to be rescheduled because the director of mobile is running a triathlon. Are we going to have a scrum with the SA's and network ops? Maybe promotions occur via, uh, tests and a grading system. Maybe they occur because one VP likes another director.
It's a social structure that has no bearing on the world outside of the organization, with it's own internal cliques and language and popularity contests. Dare I say there's a fair amount of bullying involved as well. If you leave to become an independent, you realize it was all crap.
I don't think High School is really that much of an anomaly. It's just a collection different sub-organizations and power structure than what you find in other organizations.
Except... Work at a company that has more than a handful of people. Who is the PM, the VP of sales, the product manager? Creative is mad at engineering because they have to redo all the graphics to make room for a new javascirpt dropdown. The tech exec meeting has to be rescheduled because the director of mobile is running a triathlon. Are we going to have a scrum with the SA's and network ops? Maybe promotions occur via, uh, tests and a grading system. Maybe they occur because one VP likes another director.
It's a social structure that has no bearing on the world outside of the organization, with it's own internal cliques and language and popularity contests. Dare I say there's a fair amount of bullying involved as well. If you leave to become an independent, you realize it was all crap.
I don't think High School is really that much of an anomaly. It's just a collection different sub-organizations and power structure than what you find in other organizations.
> It's kinda funny, because when you're inside, teachers and adults are saying this, but noone listens.
I don't quite understand. Do you mean that people who are bullied should just "not care" for 3 years, because eventually it will be over? Or are you not talking about bullying?
(I can't see the video now)
I don't quite understand. Do you mean that people who are bullied should just "not care" for 3 years, because eventually it will be over? Or are you not talking about bullying?
(I can't see the video now)
It's not a case of them needing to not care about it, just that if they understood how the balance of ups and downs would end up over life, they would be more able to get through those years.
High school is where a select few get to be popular just before they spend the rest of their lives pumping gas and waiting tablets for a living.
Germany, as one example, actually separates out their high school system is split. From:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_Germany
> German secondary education includes four types of school. The Gymnasium is designed to prepare pupils for university education and finishes with the final examination Abitur,
> after grade 12 or 13. The Realschule has a broader range of emphasis for intermediate pupils and finishes with the final examination Mittlere Reife, after grade 10; the Hauptschule
> prepares pupils for vocational education and finishes with the final examination Hauptschulabschluss, after grade 9 or 10 and the Realschulabschluss after grade 10. There are two types
> of grade 10: one is the higher level called type 10b and the lower level is called type 10a; only the higher level type 10b can lead to the Realschule and this finishes with the final
> examination Mittlere Reife after grade 10b. This new path of achieving the Realschulabschluss at a vocationally-oriented secondary school was changed by the statutory school
> regulations in 1981 - with a one-year qualifying period. During the one-year qualifying period of the change to the new regulations, pupils could continue with class 10 to fulfil the
> statutory period of education. After 1982, the new path was compulsory, as explained above. Other than this, there is the Gesamtschule, which combines the approaches. There are also
> Förderschulen/Sonderschulen. One in 21 pupils attends a Förderschule.[2][3] Nevertheless the Förderschulen/Sonderschulen can also lead, in special
> circumstances, to a Hauptschulabschluss of both type 10a or type 10b, the latter of which is the Realschulabschluss.
Perhaps the reason that high school is so disconnected to the rest of life is that everyone goes through the same system. After that, you go to college (or not). Whether or not you go, to what school you go and what you study is largely merit-based.
The private education system is better in some ways but isn't merit-based. It's largely a function of the economic circumstances of the students' parents.
Germany, as one example, actually separates out their high school system is split. From:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_Germany
> German secondary education includes four types of school. The Gymnasium is designed to prepare pupils for university education and finishes with the final examination Abitur,
> after grade 12 or 13. The Realschule has a broader range of emphasis for intermediate pupils and finishes with the final examination Mittlere Reife, after grade 10; the Hauptschule
> prepares pupils for vocational education and finishes with the final examination Hauptschulabschluss, after grade 9 or 10 and the Realschulabschluss after grade 10. There are two types
> of grade 10: one is the higher level called type 10b and the lower level is called type 10a; only the higher level type 10b can lead to the Realschule and this finishes with the final
> examination Mittlere Reife after grade 10b. This new path of achieving the Realschulabschluss at a vocationally-oriented secondary school was changed by the statutory school
> regulations in 1981 - with a one-year qualifying period. During the one-year qualifying period of the change to the new regulations, pupils could continue with class 10 to fulfil the
> statutory period of education. After 1982, the new path was compulsory, as explained above. Other than this, there is the Gesamtschule, which combines the approaches. There are also
> Förderschulen/Sonderschulen. One in 21 pupils attends a Förderschule.[2][3] Nevertheless the Förderschulen/Sonderschulen can also lead, in special
> circumstances, to a Hauptschulabschluss of both type 10a or type 10b, the latter of which is the Realschulabschluss.
Perhaps the reason that high school is so disconnected to the rest of life is that everyone goes through the same system. After that, you go to college (or not). Whether or not you go, to what school you go and what you study is largely merit-based.
The private education system is better in some ways but isn't merit-based. It's largely a function of the economic circumstances of the students' parents.
How funny that somebody would laud the German schooling system. They also have enough bullying --- though I do not know whether it's statistically less or more than in the US. And I only know about the Gymnasien first hand. The other types are just awful, from what I heard.
In Germany people talk about the schooling system mostly in terms of it lowering social mobility and failing to give a good education.
In Germany people talk about the schooling system mostly in terms of it lowering social mobility and failing to give a good education.
It's true the German education system is far from issue-free and I don't mean to put it up on a pedestal. Rather it is simply an example of a system that does separate out high school age students on something other than simply your geographical location.
Yes. Though geographical location also plays a huge role. There's a big north-south divide. Some Realschulen in the south are better than some Gymnasien in the north.
Thanks for posting this. Google's contribution to this project is awesome.
Thanks for sharing this. Seeing official google branding on this is pretty impressive.
It's great that Google has contributed to this project. I think it's really important for every community to set aside a little space to recognize this issue and send a clear message of support from gay and straight members alike. It's not just a gay issue, it's a matter of civil liberties, and the health of young adults in our communities. When a kid needs support that isn't available in their immediate network, at least they can know that there are many real communities all around the world where things are better. It's inspiring that a huge company like Google can offer that dream of a tangible welcoming community that a kid can aspire to be a part of someday.
Here's a good resource for LGBT entrepreneurs:
http://www.startout.org/
They have events in SF and NYC.
They have events in SF and NYC.
(disclaimer: I'm straight but I suffered from the nerd bullying from ages 5 to 14)
So, not to dump on this idea, but I heard this again and again when I was a kid. It didn't really help me feel better. My position was "That's fine, but life really sucks now"
When you say to a 7 year old "it gets better when you're 14" you're saying that he has to go through a whole second lifetime of suffering before he gets out. That's not helpful.
Better to say "It gets better when you're older and here's why. And here's how you can get some of those things early. Here's how you can find a healthy community now, which will help now."
Although to be fair, I'm sure Dan Savage et. al. would completely agree, and be the first to offer that kind of advice.
So, not to dump on this idea, but I heard this again and again when I was a kid. It didn't really help me feel better. My position was "That's fine, but life really sucks now"
When you say to a 7 year old "it gets better when you're 14" you're saying that he has to go through a whole second lifetime of suffering before he gets out. That's not helpful.
Better to say "It gets better when you're older and here's why. And here's how you can get some of those things early. Here's how you can find a healthy community now, which will help now."
Although to be fair, I'm sure Dan Savage et. al. would completely agree, and be the first to offer that kind of advice.
High school sucks for everyone, but it's worst for LGBT than almost anyone else. Suicide rate is at least 4x what it is for the general teenaged population.
However, despite being ~straight, I really want one of those "Android Pride" t-shirts from this video.
However, despite being ~straight, I really want one of those "Android Pride" t-shirts from this video.
This touched my heart, but I hope it is emphasized that sometimes the bullies are the people you love and trust the most.
Some of the commenters asked why it matters, as if gay hackers should be forced to prove why they want community. mcantor (who's straight) gave a great explanation: "Finding a community of "People Like You" can make or break someone's journey into a new field. That means the hacker community at large needs to be equally supportive of queer hackers, or a queer hacker sub-community must form."
There have been many similar discussions on here about international startup founders, female founders, older founders, younger founders, and more. I'm quite disappointed that the discussion about gay founders was shot down.