Case study: Can retailers win back shoppers who browse then buy online?(hbr.org)
hbr.org
Case study: Can retailers win back shoppers who browse then buy online?
https://hbr.org/2015/06/case-study-can-retailers-win-back-shoppers-who-browse-then-buy-online
59 comments
Heh. They're dead right about the difficulty of cutting through a million options. I feel lame every time, but I find myself just going to thesweethome.com or thewirecutter.com, and then buying whatever they tell me to :-/ Either online or locally, whichever is more convenient and/or cheaper.
Knowing next to nothing about cameras, I just bought my wife a DSLR (the Nikon D3300) based on the recommendation of thewirecutter.com, and she loves it. I don't think there's a need to feel "lame" about it -- there's a limited number of decisions I can make in a day[1] and an even smaller number that I can truly be well informed on. For all the rest, I'm totally happy to outsource my decision making to online review aggregators like yelp/amazon or curation platforms like thewirecutter.com. It seems to be working so far.
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10490354
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10490354
Absolutely. I pick out one or two key features I want beyond the basics and then see if any of the highly rated models have those. If I'm shopping for a point and click that can take a picture only when it detects everyone's eyes open, then trying to make a decision on megapixels as well is pretty much waste of my time. I might as well flip a coin or choose the highest rated model with that feature (or give up on the feature if no models rate well!).
tl;dr - My best isn't necessarily your best. We're different people with (likely) different needs.
That seems pretty foreign to me. While I would definitely look at something like that (although I've never heard of either of those sites until now, thanks), it seems weird to me that people would assume what some website thinks is "best" is so accurate as to accept their recommendation without doing any research whatsoever and immediately going out to buy that.
Even when I was a kid and had a Consumer Reports subscription I never just bought whatever they said to buy I have always done my own research. It doesn't seem that difficult to me if you have at least a rough idea of what you're looking for in an item and can prioritize those things.
That seems pretty foreign to me. While I would definitely look at something like that (although I've never heard of either of those sites until now, thanks), it seems weird to me that people would assume what some website thinks is "best" is so accurate as to accept their recommendation without doing any research whatsoever and immediately going out to buy that.
Even when I was a kid and had a Consumer Reports subscription I never just bought whatever they said to buy I have always done my own research. It doesn't seem that difficult to me if you have at least a rough idea of what you're looking for in an item and can prioritize those things.
TL;DR: there are products that fulfill your, mine and everyone elses needs simultaneously quite well.
Products in a given category aren't usually trading off their features and price perfectly. There are some products that are significantly better than their competitors in all metrics at the same time; then most of the products in any given category are a mix of weird attempts at market segmentation and companies trying to simply scam you. Therefore it's not surprising one can often select a product that is objectively the best for vast majority of potential buyers.
Products in a given category aren't usually trading off their features and price perfectly. There are some products that are significantly better than their competitors in all metrics at the same time; then most of the products in any given category are a mix of weird attempts at market segmentation and companies trying to simply scam you. Therefore it's not surprising one can often select a product that is objectively the best for vast majority of potential buyers.
Most people aren't looking for the best. Most are looking for good enough at a decent price. Trying to find the best everything (and mix that in with the best price sometimes) is a tiring experience that isn't worth it to most people. Asking an impartial third party to narrow it down for you is a huge asset. A small minority of people want to spend a significant time researching every product they buy.
The key is impartial though.
The key is impartial though.
Wirecutter has never steered me wrong. I've loved every purchase I've gotten on their recommendation. I can't speak highly enough about it.
I'd buy more locally if there was more locally to buy. I know it's a small town, but the availability of seemingly common electronics is atrocious. I can't locate, let alone buy, a monitor with greater than 1920x1080 resolution within 100 miles. A keyboard with decent mechanical switches, any form of non-toy quadcopter, even a Raspberry Pi/Arduino/Beaglebone? Somewhere in Seattle or Phoenix, if I'm lucky.
I'd kill to have a Fry's in the state.
About the only form of electronics I'm set for in-town is headphones, and that's just because Headroom was built up from this city.
I'd kill to have a Fry's in the state.
About the only form of electronics I'm set for in-town is headphones, and that's just because Headroom was built up from this city.
Another thing to note is that the auto parts industry does a pretty good job leveraging tools like Amazon and eBay. Autozone, Advance, Summit etc. They have stores and websites but also use those platforms to sell stuff and the price is generally consistent with their websites and stores or reflects the cost of using the platform (e.g. buying stuff from Summit is usually slightly cheaper for the stuff they list on eBay and I assume this is a reflection of shipping discounts.
Obviously, a franchise can't really take advantage of additional platforms the way a chain can.
Obviously, a franchise can't really take advantage of additional platforms the way a chain can.
Where online really wins for me is that I don't have go shopping along with hundreds or even thousand of other people after work or in the weekends.
I get extremely cranky when I need to stand in line or try to make my way passed other "less efficient" shoppers.
Also the stupid attempts at up-selling in electronic stores doesn't help.
Clothing I do prefer to shop in real stores though, but that's mostly because sizes aren't uniform and generally confusing.
I get extremely cranky when I need to stand in line or try to make my way passed other "less efficient" shoppers.
Also the stupid attempts at up-selling in electronic stores doesn't help.
Clothing I do prefer to shop in real stores though, but that's mostly because sizes aren't uniform and generally confusing.
Here's one thing brick-and-mortar stores could try learning from online retailers: stop bugging your customers.
If I need help looking for a TV, I'll ask. I promise, I'm not shy. But if I want to just LOOK at some TV's and see what's available, please stop hovering over my shoulder and asking me if I have any questions. I don't, really. I can read the specs. If you want me to spend $400 or more on something, you're gonna have to grant me some time to chew over the options and go home and do my research before coming back. Let me do that, and I might come back and buy from you. Pester me, stalk me, or refuse to let me leave without making veiled threats that "This TV may not be here when you come back," and I'll shop online.
For its part, Micro Center guys have usually been extremely helpful when I needed it and have always left me alone once I said "Just browsing." They've also periodically looked up the part on Newegg to see if they could price-match it.
If I need help looking for a TV, I'll ask. I promise, I'm not shy. But if I want to just LOOK at some TV's and see what's available, please stop hovering over my shoulder and asking me if I have any questions. I don't, really. I can read the specs. If you want me to spend $400 or more on something, you're gonna have to grant me some time to chew over the options and go home and do my research before coming back. Let me do that, and I might come back and buy from you. Pester me, stalk me, or refuse to let me leave without making veiled threats that "This TV may not be here when you come back," and I'll shop online.
For its part, Micro Center guys have usually been extremely helpful when I needed it and have always left me alone once I said "Just browsing." They've also periodically looked up the part on Newegg to see if they could price-match it.
...and yet some people report feeling ignored by shop staff.
Is there any research into the ideal balance between asking people if they need help and not bugging them?
Is there any research into the ideal balance between asking people if they need help and not bugging them?
Is there room for an app here, where you can declare your need for help, and the store can respond (by queuing it or whatever)?
An app? The solution has existed for decades without being more complex than a lightbulb.. hit a button that turns on a light in the area so staff can come help you.
The specific case I'm thinking of was buying a graphing calculator that was locked in a case. Hit the button and someone will come by to get you one. Same concept on airplanes too, though.
The specific case I'm thinking of was buying a graphing calculator that was locked in a case. Hit the button and someone will come by to get you one. Same concept on airplanes too, though.
Except, no queuing, no estimate of when they'll get to you, no idea if anyone will ever show up at all.
Complaints about bad service are epidemic. I'm thinking there's room for disruption here.
Complaints about bad service are epidemic. I'm thinking there's room for disruption here.
Yes, it's called a button, many pharmacies have it beside the electric shaver or other expensive items. Just put buttons next to items that call for staff.
For what its worth I basically use a two axis model for my likelihood to buy online vs. retail one axis is time frame (do i need that bathing suit right now or can i wait two weeks) this is really product agnostic - basically I'll pay a (potential) time/money premium to get something now.
the second axis is commodity vs. customization/fit on one end of the spectrum are standardized things (AA batteries, a DVD, part #12345) that i'll pretty much always buy online, the middle of that spectrum is stuff that you'd like to see in person you but would be willing to buy online (i.e. showroom): a watch (see it on your wrist first) furniture (how big is that couch). At the other end of the spectrum are things with a value added service that retailer does that i will buy in the store, something like ski boots or hockey skates where i want to try on a few, the salesman are more knowledgeable, and there is a customization/fitting process (custom footbeds or heat treatment)
the second axis is commodity vs. customization/fit on one end of the spectrum are standardized things (AA batteries, a DVD, part #12345) that i'll pretty much always buy online, the middle of that spectrum is stuff that you'd like to see in person you but would be willing to buy online (i.e. showroom): a watch (see it on your wrist first) furniture (how big is that couch). At the other end of the spectrum are things with a value added service that retailer does that i will buy in the store, something like ski boots or hockey skates where i want to try on a few, the salesman are more knowledgeable, and there is a customization/fitting process (custom footbeds or heat treatment)
The time axis is being eroded by the speed of delivery. If I order something from Amazon on a weekday, I almost always have it the next morning. For me, there is a very small window between "want it now" and "want it by tomorrow morning". For me currently, that window is basically just restaurants and groceries, which could be eliminated with better planning.
The in-store value add is a real thing, and what I think a lot of stores are going for, but for most things, the best they can do are knowledgeable salespeople, whose knowledge will never be as useful as research on the internet. I can only think of one other example where I really want a good salesperson besides ski boots: "important" clothing, like a nice suit, that benefits from professional tailoring.
The in-store value add is a real thing, and what I think a lot of stores are going for, but for most things, the best they can do are knowledgeable salespeople, whose knowledge will never be as useful as research on the internet. I can only think of one other example where I really want a good salesperson besides ski boots: "important" clothing, like a nice suit, that benefits from professional tailoring.
If I were opening a book store today, I'd do two things:
1. I'd put Amazon affiliate links everywhere. If you want to buy it from Amazon while browsing my store, go for it. I'll just get a cut of the sale via my affiliate link.
2. If you buy a Kindle version via Amazon, I'll discount you on the hard copy that you buy from my store. That way you'll have both versions, if desired.
I have absolutely no idea if this would be effective, but I think one thing booksellers are going to have to do to stay competitive is adopt something like this, where you're not shutting the customer down. I'm one of those people who browses the store and then buys on Amazon, but that's mainly because I have a Kindle with hundreds of books, and I only buy hard copies of my favorites. If a store enabled that -- and profited from -- then that would be awesome. I'd love to give a small kickback to my local store for showing me what's available, even if I bought it from Amazon in the end.
1. I'd put Amazon affiliate links everywhere. If you want to buy it from Amazon while browsing my store, go for it. I'll just get a cut of the sale via my affiliate link.
2. If you buy a Kindle version via Amazon, I'll discount you on the hard copy that you buy from my store. That way you'll have both versions, if desired.
I have absolutely no idea if this would be effective, but I think one thing booksellers are going to have to do to stay competitive is adopt something like this, where you're not shutting the customer down. I'm one of those people who browses the store and then buys on Amazon, but that's mainly because I have a Kindle with hundreds of books, and I only buy hard copies of my favorites. If a store enabled that -- and profited from -- then that would be awesome. I'd love to give a small kickback to my local store for showing me what's available, even if I bought it from Amazon in the end.
Off-topic: I couldn't find anything online about Benjy's, aside from the HBR article. Anyone know what's going on?
Its either a made up company for the case study, or pseudonym for best buy. The case study teaching notes refer to best buy instead of "benjy's".
As a Brit I can remember the real High Street Benjy's experience - unbelievably cheap sandwiches that seemed great at first, but, by Thursday, you never wanted to eat one of their sandwiches ever again!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjys
Sadly they did go bust and people started going elsewhere for their cheap meal deals.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjys
Sadly they did go bust and people started going elsewhere for their cheap meal deals.
The article is an advertising piece for Wayfair, and doesn't even try to hide it.
The truth is that retailers, especially large retailers have a lot of tools to fight back against e-tailers:
- Demanding manufacturers to set and enforce Minimal Advertised Price.
- Exclusive products. If Macy's ask for a new product to be theirs only, they usually get their wish granted.
- Geo lockout. Smaller retailers are granted geo-local monopoly.
- Custom SKUs to thwart price lookups and price matches. Samsung makes the same TV in BestBuy SKU, Sears SKU, Costco SKU, generic SKU, and likely others.
- Own ecomerce portals, like Macy's or Nordstrom.
- Local returns and repairs.
And that's not all of it. At our startup we're making many of these tools available to smaller retailers and manufacturers, if you want to join, my email is in profile. In particular we're hot on post-visit engagement workflow, the stuff of the 21st century.
Retail is far from dead. If it were, they wouldn't need the advertising piece in HBR.
The truth is that retailers, especially large retailers have a lot of tools to fight back against e-tailers:
- Demanding manufacturers to set and enforce Minimal Advertised Price.
- Exclusive products. If Macy's ask for a new product to be theirs only, they usually get their wish granted.
- Geo lockout. Smaller retailers are granted geo-local monopoly.
- Custom SKUs to thwart price lookups and price matches. Samsung makes the same TV in BestBuy SKU, Sears SKU, Costco SKU, generic SKU, and likely others.
- Own ecomerce portals, like Macy's or Nordstrom.
- Local returns and repairs.
And that's not all of it. At our startup we're making many of these tools available to smaller retailers and manufacturers, if you want to join, my email is in profile. In particular we're hot on post-visit engagement workflow, the stuff of the 21st century.
Retail is far from dead. If it were, they wouldn't need the advertising piece in HBR.
Besides the local repairs, all of these seem to attempt to stop people from being able to purchase the items you can see in store cheaper online, which makes the assumption that if the shopper can't find the item cheaper online they will purchase it in store.
It seems unlikely that a shopper savvy enough to have an item recognition app is going to not know what the online price is for a similar item, even if it's not identical.
Consumers obviously assign some value to being able to see the actual item, but it's not clear that the value is as high as you need to sustain a retail operation vs a generous returns policy.
It seems unlikely that a shopper savvy enough to have an item recognition app is going to not know what the online price is for a similar item, even if it's not identical.
Consumers obviously assign some value to being able to see the actual item, but it's not clear that the value is as high as you need to sustain a retail operation vs a generous returns policy.
After Amazon threatened to close my paid Prime account because I was returning too many things (totally false) I'm now going back to the brick and mortar stores too. As more and more people get alienated by policies that aren't even written down, applied transparently and randomly by stupid algorithms, I think more people will deal with the inconvenience of shopping in person or at the very least look for online retailers that don't tell their paying customers who have been spending $10-30k a year regularly for many years to go fuck themselves.
I think there's a lot of chances for retails stores as people realize that the promise of online technologies is incredibly hindered by their actualization and the artificial limits imposed by such unscrupulous vendors as Amazon.
I think there's a lot of chances for retails stores as people realize that the promise of online technologies is incredibly hindered by their actualization and the artificial limits imposed by such unscrupulous vendors as Amazon.
Sometimes I wonder why nobody opens a showroom that doesn't sell products, but only shows stuff. (At a fee of course.)
But it might cost too much to finance all the products you wish/have to show. Manufactures can help and donate demo gear :)
But it might cost too much to finance all the products you wish/have to show. Manufactures can help and donate demo gear :)
I predict this will happen with self driving cars. They will very rapidly lead to pay per journey uber style. They will also easily be able to do deliveries (arrive at home when you do, wave phone/enter pin to unlock delivery box).
Rather than go to multiple stores, each surrounded by a large car park, it would be more desireable to go to a collection of stores that are colocated, pick out what you want, and have it delivered as you get home so you don't have to carry it around.
Rather than go to multiple stores, each surrounded by a large car park, it would be more desireable to go to a collection of stores that are colocated, pick out what you want, and have it delivered as you get home so you don't have to carry it around.
It's called a trade show, and pretty much every type of product has some. I agree that there could be a room between them and shops, i.e. small-scale displays, but at this point why not just let one buy the stuff?
Trade shows are temporary. The advantage of a permanent showroom is that people know they can always go look at things right now.
> why not just let one buy the stuff?
Because then the store needs inventory, and all the overhead that entails. It is much cheaper to keep a single copy of everything.
But the perhaps bigger issue is one of incentives. I hate that when I'm at Best Buy looking at things, I know I'm being an annoying "showroomer", rather than a customer doing the correct and desired thing. Removing on-site sales from the equation aligns the incentives. Now the showroom will want to do whatever they can to make it easier for me to buy online, so that they get credit (and presumably commission) for the sale. Instead of trickery to confuse object recognition apps, maybe they'll make a really good augmented reality app that makes it stupidly easy to one-click order the exact thing they're looking at.
> why not just let one buy the stuff?
Because then the store needs inventory, and all the overhead that entails. It is much cheaper to keep a single copy of everything.
But the perhaps bigger issue is one of incentives. I hate that when I'm at Best Buy looking at things, I know I'm being an annoying "showroomer", rather than a customer doing the correct and desired thing. Removing on-site sales from the equation aligns the incentives. Now the showroom will want to do whatever they can to make it easier for me to buy online, so that they get credit (and presumably commission) for the sale. Instead of trickery to confuse object recognition apps, maybe they'll make a really good augmented reality app that makes it stupidly easy to one-click order the exact thing they're looking at.
Thanks, you wrote some good points I haven't considered. You've actually convinced me and now I wish for a permanent showroom too. I wonder, maybe electronics stores will slowly evolve towards that? Order on-line and pick up at store is already a thing, and the second part of the equation would be just a streamlined mobile buying experience.
This was attemped in the past to a lesser degree.
Best Products (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_Products#Retail_concept) and Service Merchandise(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Service_Merchandise#Showroom_o...) are the two I tried when I was younger.
I can’t believe that kind of people do exist.
We have a game store where you can go to play the board games and buy the ones you like. It's crowded but I don't know if people actually purchases things.
Looks can also be deceiving, because of "Friday Night Magic" at least for one evening a week what is believed to be an independent FLGS is actually a junk food convenience store at least WRT revenue by product. Or so I've been told by someone who should know. There are other theme nights, its just "Friday Night Magic" is the most popular.
Its not a very profitable or well run convenience store compared to a real convenience store, but it does well enough. As do most FLGS that run friday night magic. I'm sure there are some that can't sell junk food due to zoning or ordinances, that must be annoying.
The problem is scaling it outside a couple hours Friday night. Another day of the week, six guys playing pathfinder on a card table makes the store look busy compared to a usually completely empty antique store, but what kind of revenue is rolling in per hour? You can pay the electric bill by selling monster energy drinks out of the cooler, but retail establishments have other bills to pay, and the antique store only needs one sale per week to pay their bills...
Its not a very profitable or well run convenience store compared to a real convenience store, but it does well enough. As do most FLGS that run friday night magic. I'm sure there are some that can't sell junk food due to zoning or ordinances, that must be annoying.
The problem is scaling it outside a couple hours Friday night. Another day of the week, six guys playing pathfinder on a card table makes the store look busy compared to a usually completely empty antique store, but what kind of revenue is rolling in per hour? You can pay the electric bill by selling monster energy drinks out of the cooler, but retail establishments have other bills to pay, and the antique store only needs one sale per week to pay their bills...
Just for contrast, our local card store has 8 tables available for whatever. They also have Magic tournaments, MechWarrior tables, a variety of things. They make their money selling - you guessed it, card games. The other half of the store is aisles of boxed games, old and new.
The tables get busy every evening of the week, after folks get out of school/off work. The age range is teens through 30-somethings.
The tables get busy every evening of the week, after folks get out of school/off work. The age range is teens through 30-somethings.
I go to play magic on Sundays. :)
I am not counting the magic players. Though there is certainly an overlap with the board game players.
The shop is a restaurant and cafe.
http://www.moxboardinghouse.com/
I am not counting the magic players. Though there is certainly an overlap with the board game players.
The shop is a restaurant and cafe.
http://www.moxboardinghouse.com/
Instant gratification and no shipping cost on larger items is the only way local stores can deal with Amazon.
Somehow Best Buy is still in business so they must be doing that.
Somehow Best Buy is still in business so they must be doing that.
Its interesting that none of the case study results faced reality; you're obsolete, pivot or close. Lots of long winded meandering that boils down to fiddling while rome burns. You've got legacy revenue for awhile, real estate, and employees, take advantage of it and pivot. "I know, we'll try to undercut the entire internet" LOL "We'll just work harder than everyone else" LOL "We'll sell only the most expensive products to the richest customers because they like to waste time" LOL "We'll define excellent service as being obnoxious and in your face as possible" LOL The first consultant is featherbedding "We need more consultants to get more data".
For example, Barnes and Noble has abandoned selling books and has pivoted semi successfully into "convenience store for birthday gifts" complete with wrapping. They still have a section of the store for books, but its not really a book store anymore. They have a better chocolate section than my local discount grocery store! In the specific example, moving in on B+N turf isn't going to work as a strategy unless you think you can out B+N, B+N itself.
AFAIK no one has ever tried food and consumer electronics shopping, so eat "real" food while showrooming sample TVs and then order one shipped to your door. This is not entirely insane. A liquor license and pleasant wait staff might discourage showrooming... "Hey everyone gets a round on the house, Joey bought a new TV" woo hoo ...
Something to think about is there is more retail CRE square footage today than ever in the history of the country and its all more or less becoming useless as currently designed and zoned. You may end up pivoting totally out of old fashioned retail, perhaps a fitness club, or barber shop, or restaurant. You want to be the first retail market to become an exercise club not try to be the last. Locally food and other retail stores that have closed have successfully opened as credit union branches, exercise club, restaurants, and car dealerships, more examples probably exist. To make a large scale national strategy, it might be useful to gather this small scale success data. Apparently you cannot pay the rent selling turnips in that specific retail frontage, but you can pay the rent selling time on a bench press machine, interesting...
Alternately you can ride right down into a crater, like that crazy general in Dr Strangelove, if it no longer works just keep on doing what doesn't work but harder than everyone else, what could possibly go wrong? In all honesty if you have no future it does show bravery of a sort to keep doing what you're doing until the bankruptcy, but admit what you're doing, at least, you're just riding a dead business model until impact with the ground, milking the last cash cow till it becomes pink slime.
For example, Barnes and Noble has abandoned selling books and has pivoted semi successfully into "convenience store for birthday gifts" complete with wrapping. They still have a section of the store for books, but its not really a book store anymore. They have a better chocolate section than my local discount grocery store! In the specific example, moving in on B+N turf isn't going to work as a strategy unless you think you can out B+N, B+N itself.
AFAIK no one has ever tried food and consumer electronics shopping, so eat "real" food while showrooming sample TVs and then order one shipped to your door. This is not entirely insane. A liquor license and pleasant wait staff might discourage showrooming... "Hey everyone gets a round on the house, Joey bought a new TV" woo hoo ...
Something to think about is there is more retail CRE square footage today than ever in the history of the country and its all more or less becoming useless as currently designed and zoned. You may end up pivoting totally out of old fashioned retail, perhaps a fitness club, or barber shop, or restaurant. You want to be the first retail market to become an exercise club not try to be the last. Locally food and other retail stores that have closed have successfully opened as credit union branches, exercise club, restaurants, and car dealerships, more examples probably exist. To make a large scale national strategy, it might be useful to gather this small scale success data. Apparently you cannot pay the rent selling turnips in that specific retail frontage, but you can pay the rent selling time on a bench press machine, interesting...
Alternately you can ride right down into a crater, like that crazy general in Dr Strangelove, if it no longer works just keep on doing what doesn't work but harder than everyone else, what could possibly go wrong? In all honesty if you have no future it does show bravery of a sort to keep doing what you're doing until the bankruptcy, but admit what you're doing, at least, you're just riding a dead business model until impact with the ground, milking the last cash cow till it becomes pink slime.
Yeah, I can't help but scream at every one of their lame proposals: This is what drives people to buy online in the first place!
What's never mentioned is simply having their every day price match the online prices. But this is so glaringly obvious I assume it's simply financially impractical. I've really got to wonder what kind of margins they have to bridge?
Lobbying their state to drop sales tax and being 5-10% higher than online, but being open about it and marketing based on immediate service might work. Then again if it's a 30% chasm the situation seems quite hopeless.
As an aside, I wonder if they could get manufacturers to supply floor models gratis, or even paying a little for exhibition. After all, a brick and mortar store is essentially a giant billboard. Much better than some "minimum advertised price" anti-competitive bullshit.
What's never mentioned is simply having their every day price match the online prices. But this is so glaringly obvious I assume it's simply financially impractical. I've really got to wonder what kind of margins they have to bridge?
Lobbying their state to drop sales tax and being 5-10% higher than online, but being open about it and marketing based on immediate service might work. Then again if it's a 30% chasm the situation seems quite hopeless.
As an aside, I wonder if they could get manufacturers to supply floor models gratis, or even paying a little for exhibition. After all, a brick and mortar store is essentially a giant billboard. Much better than some "minimum advertised price" anti-competitive bullshit.
Sigh. I will buy online for most things. Things I don't: groceries, clothes. (Why: Our meat guy takes orders and we pay and pick up. Avg bill~$55. Grocery doesn't have automated picking -krogers-. Would use it if we could.)
Now, why do I buy online? There's many reasons.
1. I'm price sensitive. I don't make that much, so my money must count. Doing X means not doing Y, even for small values of X. Online is just cheaper.
2. Your place doesn't have what I want. I've went into electronics stores, looking for X. Except what I see is some version less and something much higher. Or they play with model names, where kwin-123xyz-tgt is at Target and kwin123xyz-wmt is at Walmart, and have no differences, other than a model ID that's dependent on store, to prevent price matching.
3. Salespeople are idiots. I've had them try to "inform" me of all sorts of inane "Its really true that..." and other lies or mistruths. I don't need your research, salesperson. Nor do I think you deserve your commission for your BS.
4. Salespeople are pushy (and worse; hard sell). Nothing turns me off from shopping than that behavior. I hate it, and will walk out as soon as they start engaging in it. One case I went back to them after making the sale and told them that their hard sell is why they did not make the sale.
5. Lines suck. As in, really suck. I have the non-choice of waiting in a too long line for some disinterested clerk to ring stuff up. Compare this to Amazon and other web stores where I can click buttons and "BUY....DONE!". Yeah, there's shipping. But I can get on with my day. Lines suck time I'll never get back.
6. Other shoppers. We're approaching the 'Black Days', where you will be neck-to-neck with other crazed deal-going shoppers. Some are in various states of unbathedness whilst many others are completely rude. The net eliminates this, completely... unless you go to forums like Reddit and intentionally find areas like /r/SRS
7. Going to another store = loads to time. I'm looking around 5 mins to park and walk, 10 mins to find, and 5 mins to pay, and 2 mins to leave. Total 22 mins. On the net, I can search a dozen stores at the same time. And nobody complains if I search another company while on the first's web site.
8. I don't get real-time reviews on items in store. I have to rely on the box (marketing), the ads (more marketing), and general feel if there's a sample. Online, I can see the reviews of pretty much anything, can analyze trends in good and bad, and can make a generally informed decision.
9. Pricing issues. I regularly get problems with incorrect prices on things. Usually it's taken care of, but turns out to be a big "Stop registers, send someone to look, and report back". Retarded and inefficient.
10. Coupons/cards. I have an account on some eCommerce site. Or I use Paypal directly and not make an account. It just works. Versus the brick and mortar stores, where they play games with "discounts, but not this way, and not here, but only on that with that". And you need those damned shopper cards. It's one thing to have a single card, but every store wants you to have one.
That enough reasons why?
Now, why do I buy online? There's many reasons.
1. I'm price sensitive. I don't make that much, so my money must count. Doing X means not doing Y, even for small values of X. Online is just cheaper.
2. Your place doesn't have what I want. I've went into electronics stores, looking for X. Except what I see is some version less and something much higher. Or they play with model names, where kwin-123xyz-tgt is at Target and kwin123xyz-wmt is at Walmart, and have no differences, other than a model ID that's dependent on store, to prevent price matching.
3. Salespeople are idiots. I've had them try to "inform" me of all sorts of inane "Its really true that..." and other lies or mistruths. I don't need your research, salesperson. Nor do I think you deserve your commission for your BS.
4. Salespeople are pushy (and worse; hard sell). Nothing turns me off from shopping than that behavior. I hate it, and will walk out as soon as they start engaging in it. One case I went back to them after making the sale and told them that their hard sell is why they did not make the sale.
5. Lines suck. As in, really suck. I have the non-choice of waiting in a too long line for some disinterested clerk to ring stuff up. Compare this to Amazon and other web stores where I can click buttons and "BUY....DONE!". Yeah, there's shipping. But I can get on with my day. Lines suck time I'll never get back.
6. Other shoppers. We're approaching the 'Black Days', where you will be neck-to-neck with other crazed deal-going shoppers. Some are in various states of unbathedness whilst many others are completely rude. The net eliminates this, completely... unless you go to forums like Reddit and intentionally find areas like /r/SRS
7. Going to another store = loads to time. I'm looking around 5 mins to park and walk, 10 mins to find, and 5 mins to pay, and 2 mins to leave. Total 22 mins. On the net, I can search a dozen stores at the same time. And nobody complains if I search another company while on the first's web site.
8. I don't get real-time reviews on items in store. I have to rely on the box (marketing), the ads (more marketing), and general feel if there's a sample. Online, I can see the reviews of pretty much anything, can analyze trends in good and bad, and can make a generally informed decision.
9. Pricing issues. I regularly get problems with incorrect prices on things. Usually it's taken care of, but turns out to be a big "Stop registers, send someone to look, and report back". Retarded and inefficient.
10. Coupons/cards. I have an account on some eCommerce site. Or I use Paypal directly and not make an account. It just works. Versus the brick and mortar stores, where they play games with "discounts, but not this way, and not here, but only on that with that". And you need those damned shopper cards. It's one thing to have a single card, but every store wants you to have one.
That enough reasons why?
I agree with all of this. For your sales people getting paid on commission they will, of course, flat out lie and try to up sell you things or combine those together to say they're out of something they have and try to sell you something more expensive because you look like you need it (I'm looking at you Fry's).
I do the opposite. I don't want to spend the time driving around looking at stuff, so I research online, and then find where it's sold locally. 'cause I want it the instant I pay for it, and returns are much easier and immediate at a store.
I do buy from Amazon, but Amazon is also one of the best research tools for local buying.
I do buy from Amazon, but Amazon is also one of the best research tools for local buying.
I'm shocked that people continue to "showroom" items. The local Best Buy has a terrible selection of items and the employees don't know any more about the products than I do. It doesn't make any sense to go to Best Buy for anything at all - there is almost literally zero value added by a big chain electronics store.
I can think of a few things that you just need to see or feel.
I was shopping for a monitor and all the reviews on Amazon are great but I can't see the difference on my current monitor or what it actually looks like despite all the specs listed.
I did buy it on Amazon but only after I saw the actual differences in store.
I was shopping for a monitor and all the reviews on Amazon are great but I can't see the difference on my current monitor or what it actually looks like despite all the specs listed.
I did buy it on Amazon but only after I saw the actual differences in store.
Yeah for something like a tv or monitor, you have to see it in person or you're rolling the dice. How's the glare? How does it look from other angles beside straight on? Hows this 4K res compare to the one next to it?
Even if Amazon could provide a Hololens sessions for me to look at the product (which maybe they should do at some future Amazon retail location) alongside all the specs and reviews, it's still not going to bridge the gap of seeing it in person.
Even if Amazon could provide a Hololens sessions for me to look at the product (which maybe they should do at some future Amazon retail location) alongside all the specs and reviews, it's still not going to bridge the gap of seeing it in person.
Amazon could integrate that into Amazon Prime Now (1 hour delivery service). They could charge a small showroom fee and have a driver go out with a "floor model" they keep at the warehouse and an unopened box model for if you want to buy it on the spot.
Wow. The value of human time is incredibly low, if that can be made to work.
I have this thought every time I see a sign waiver.
I have this thought every time I see a sign waiver.
Depends on your preferences... I prefer to read reviews online then buy in the store. One reason being, you get the product right away.
Second, if the product is defective, it is just another quick drive to the store to have it replaced.
I am like this also... I wish I could just type into a search engine what I'm looking for and it comes up with
"Hey, this thing is available at these local retailers for these prices, all within 5km of your house. Here are the returns policies for those places. Here are the caveats to their warranty programs. These places have free parking. Caution: Place X, Y or Z only takes cash. Here's a list of ATMs enroute."
I really only buy from Amazon if I don't need something right now. Parting with my money only to have to wait for what I paid for for 4-6 weeks rubs me the wrong way.
Conversely, retail outlets could easily win me back by having their full catalogue on their website, which details in-store stock availability for my closest stores along with their final prices (including applicable discounts and taxes) and allowing me to place a hold on that item so that when I get to the store, it is there, waiting for me. The store locators are good and telling me how many are available in the store I've chosen is a good starting point, but it would be way more useful if I could put in what I'm looking for and then the site tell me the closest store that has availability and allow me to place a hold. Don't make me dig to figure out where I've gotta find stuff - remove the friction.
I've gotta be honest, it would take almost nothing to get me to go back to retail stores. Mostly I don't go because:
- I hate queueing up to wait for stuff - because I hate crowds of people and I hate wasting time. Time is the one commodity that nobody can replace no matter how rich you are. Stop wasting mine.
- The customer service is atrocious. I'm in your store because I need a product that you happen to provide. You're after my money. Appreciate that I could take my business somewhere I don't have to put up with the friction I have to suffer at your store or your diabolical staff attitudes.
- The warranties and provisos to their return policies are intentionally misleading. You have a product I want. You don't have to mislead me to buy it... if you're being so underhanded as to lead me to purchase items that are actually of zero use to me by making me believe that they are of use to me - until such a time as I try to use them and find that they are useless, there's a special place reserved in hell for you.
Find ways to remove those obstacles and I'll be back in a heartbeat. It doesn't take much:
- Appreciate my business.
- Make it easy to do business with you.
- Remove the obstacles and unnecessary friction that make me want to go elsewhere.
"Hey, this thing is available at these local retailers for these prices, all within 5km of your house. Here are the returns policies for those places. Here are the caveats to their warranty programs. These places have free parking. Caution: Place X, Y or Z only takes cash. Here's a list of ATMs enroute."
I really only buy from Amazon if I don't need something right now. Parting with my money only to have to wait for what I paid for for 4-6 weeks rubs me the wrong way.
Conversely, retail outlets could easily win me back by having their full catalogue on their website, which details in-store stock availability for my closest stores along with their final prices (including applicable discounts and taxes) and allowing me to place a hold on that item so that when I get to the store, it is there, waiting for me. The store locators are good and telling me how many are available in the store I've chosen is a good starting point, but it would be way more useful if I could put in what I'm looking for and then the site tell me the closest store that has availability and allow me to place a hold. Don't make me dig to figure out where I've gotta find stuff - remove the friction.
I've gotta be honest, it would take almost nothing to get me to go back to retail stores. Mostly I don't go because:
- I hate queueing up to wait for stuff - because I hate crowds of people and I hate wasting time. Time is the one commodity that nobody can replace no matter how rich you are. Stop wasting mine.
- The customer service is atrocious. I'm in your store because I need a product that you happen to provide. You're after my money. Appreciate that I could take my business somewhere I don't have to put up with the friction I have to suffer at your store or your diabolical staff attitudes.
- The warranties and provisos to their return policies are intentionally misleading. You have a product I want. You don't have to mislead me to buy it... if you're being so underhanded as to lead me to purchase items that are actually of zero use to me by making me believe that they are of use to me - until such a time as I try to use them and find that they are useless, there's a special place reserved in hell for you.
Find ways to remove those obstacles and I'll be back in a heartbeat. It doesn't take much:
- Appreciate my business.
- Make it easy to do business with you.
- Remove the obstacles and unnecessary friction that make me want to go elsewhere.
Agree with all.
On the warranties: I think that the warranties are offered by someone else. The airlines do it that way for travel insurance. It's probably a no brainer for an executive meeting with a warranty rep to say "hell yeah, almost no cost to us, and lots of people are stupid enough to buy this."
The retailer is paid to disrespect you.
On the warranties: I think that the warranties are offered by someone else. The airlines do it that way for travel insurance. It's probably a no brainer for an executive meeting with a warranty rep to say "hell yeah, almost no cost to us, and lots of people are stupid enough to buy this."
The retailer is paid to disrespect you.
Yes. Personally, I like to say: "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is to separate it from good men with enough levels of abstraction".
Or as the great HN quote goes,
"Any sufficiently advanced business model is indistinguishable from a scam." -- dsirijus, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8227941
Or as the great HN quote goes,
"Any sufficiently advanced business model is indistinguishable from a scam." -- dsirijus, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8227941
You wait 4-6 weeks for delivery?
For some stuff, I have waited even longer... and that's even living in a modern connected city in North America.
Wow. I routinely wait 3 weeks for stuff from China. The few things that I can get locally, the Chinese are 1/4 the price, if not less.
And then there's things that are hard/impossible to get. Laser modules, radio boards, high velocity GPS boards. Those sorts of things.
And then there's things that are hard/impossible to get. Laser modules, radio boards, high velocity GPS boards. Those sorts of things.
agreed, an accurate in store inventory listing on retailers' websites are vital for this to work. Nothing more frustrating then doing research online, getting to the store to find out they don't actually have the item in stock, or cant't find it. Then its straight onto an online shop - and not the brick and mortar retailers.
This is the holy grail of "omni-channel retail" - of being able to offer a consistent experience across all channels. But spend a few days inside any large retail company and you'll be shocked at how badly organized they are. Not only do their systems not talk to one another, their people in e-commerce and b&m operations barely know each other.
This seems to be true for most large companies. From the outside, everything looks great and everyone is going towards one clear direction but internally, everyone is actually in an isolated silo living its own life and no-one actually discuss with each other. On the worst cases, you even have some internal competition within these silos.
I've seen this even in small companies.
Yeah, I'm a mix between the two. I do use Amazon because it makes it easy to compare lots of products and prices and when they have something I want with Prime shipping (and occasionally same-day shipping) it beats driving around to the store.
At the same time, if something is available at roughly the same price (can be a little more) at a local store, I would just as soon pick it up in person and avoid the shipping delay. Essentially, I'm willing to pay a little more for fast delivery but I'm just as willing to pay a little more for the "instant gratification" of just being able to go pick the thing up.
The main difference I've found is that lots of physical retail stores often don't have what I want or their online inventory system is unreliable so something will show as in stock locally but when I go to the actual store, it's nowhere to be found. Shopping online (for me) is often more about finding the exact item I want than it is about saving a few bucks by ordering direct.
Recent example: a friend wanted me to build him a new desktop PC for general use and for gaming. Maybe 5 years ago I'd have gone straight to Newegg because no retail location would have the selection of parts needed to build the best PC I could build within his budget. But now we have a Microcenter nearby and while smaller components (cables, RAM, etc) might cost a few dollars more per item, they sell CPUs at a sizable discount as loss leaders so the total build is roughly equal to the Newegg price plus shipping cost. In that case, it's nicer to just go to the store, compare stuff like build quality of computer cases in person, get everything home that day (no shipping wait), and have a local place where I can go if something turns out to be defective. No waiting for lengthy RMA shipping delays, just an hour on a Saturday to stop in and swap something out.
So I guess from a customer's perspective, retail is still a good option and worth some level of cost premium as long as selection is good and I can verify that the items I want are in stock. The other bit I haven't mentioned is access. In the case of Microcenter, I just walk in, grab a cart, and pick up all of my parts. When I just bought an iPhone to replace my girlfriend's older model, I ordered direct from Apple rather than going to the Apple store. Apple store would've had the phone in my hand on the same day but it is located in a shopping mall. I really, really hate going to that shopping mall because it means driving around a parking garage and then navigating floors of shops and escalators and crowds in order to get to the Apple store. I'll totally wait a day or two for shipping if it means I don't need to step foot in the mall.
At the same time, if something is available at roughly the same price (can be a little more) at a local store, I would just as soon pick it up in person and avoid the shipping delay. Essentially, I'm willing to pay a little more for fast delivery but I'm just as willing to pay a little more for the "instant gratification" of just being able to go pick the thing up.
The main difference I've found is that lots of physical retail stores often don't have what I want or their online inventory system is unreliable so something will show as in stock locally but when I go to the actual store, it's nowhere to be found. Shopping online (for me) is often more about finding the exact item I want than it is about saving a few bucks by ordering direct.
Recent example: a friend wanted me to build him a new desktop PC for general use and for gaming. Maybe 5 years ago I'd have gone straight to Newegg because no retail location would have the selection of parts needed to build the best PC I could build within his budget. But now we have a Microcenter nearby and while smaller components (cables, RAM, etc) might cost a few dollars more per item, they sell CPUs at a sizable discount as loss leaders so the total build is roughly equal to the Newegg price plus shipping cost. In that case, it's nicer to just go to the store, compare stuff like build quality of computer cases in person, get everything home that day (no shipping wait), and have a local place where I can go if something turns out to be defective. No waiting for lengthy RMA shipping delays, just an hour on a Saturday to stop in and swap something out.
So I guess from a customer's perspective, retail is still a good option and worth some level of cost premium as long as selection is good and I can verify that the items I want are in stock. The other bit I haven't mentioned is access. In the case of Microcenter, I just walk in, grab a cart, and pick up all of my parts. When I just bought an iPhone to replace my girlfriend's older model, I ordered direct from Apple rather than going to the Apple store. Apple store would've had the phone in my hand on the same day but it is located in a shopping mall. I really, really hate going to that shopping mall because it means driving around a parking garage and then navigating floors of shops and escalators and crowds in order to get to the Apple store. I'll totally wait a day or two for shipping if it means I don't need to step foot in the mall.