Ask YC: Rigorous CS curriculum with dedicated students?
9 comments
Stanford and UIUC probably win in terms of startups just because of number of grads in the startup world, but I'm perfectly happy here at Carnegie Mellon...the job fairs are full of all the big-name software companies as well as some startups, we have a Google office literally next to campus, and the school is diverse enough that if you ever tire of the CS personality there are plenty of liberal arts folks, as well as a whole city full of college students. Granted, the weather isn't that great, but the classes are challenging, the professors are great, and the people are nerdy.
Of course, most everyone here is going to be pushing their alma mater, so my advice is to visit as many of the major CS schools as you can. You get a comparable education at all of them, I doubt one is that much better than the rest, so go with whichever one feels right. Ask random students walking to class about the best and worst thing about the school, ask about the courses and workload, and most importantly see if you like the area: distance from home, climate, how big-city it is. You're going to need to live there for 4(ish) years, you want somewhere that you'll enjoy living in so that you don't lock yourself in your room and burn out.
Oh, and if you're visiting CMU drop me a line, I'll show you around (current student).
Of course, most everyone here is going to be pushing their alma mater, so my advice is to visit as many of the major CS schools as you can. You get a comparable education at all of them, I doubt one is that much better than the rest, so go with whichever one feels right. Ask random students walking to class about the best and worst thing about the school, ask about the courses and workload, and most importantly see if you like the area: distance from home, climate, how big-city it is. You're going to need to live there for 4(ish) years, you want somewhere that you'll enjoy living in so that you don't lock yourself in your room and burn out.
Oh, and if you're visiting CMU drop me a line, I'll show you around (current student).
I would not choose my undergraduate university based on what types of technologies they teach in their courses. Any schools that make a big deal about teaching you stuff you can use tomorrow are not programs aiming at future-proofing their graduates.
Which is to say, prefer that your first programming class is in Scheme, not AJAX.
Which is to say, prefer that your first programming class is in Scheme, not AJAX.
Stanford has an excellent computer _science_ department. A degree in computer science at Stanford will expose you to functional and object-oriented programming; it will give you a solid grounding in discrete mathematics, automata theory, and the design and analysis of algorithms; it will teach you the fundamentals of compiler and operating system design and implementation; you can also choose to take classes in computer security, networking, programming languages, artificial intelligence, robotics, computer vision, graphics, databases, human-computer interaction, and computational genomics, among other subjects.
"Newer technologies" are offered, particularly in the CS193 classes. I wouldn't waste my time on them though; you can learn as much by reading documentation online. (The exception is the class on Objective-C and Cocoa. Final projects are presented to Apple engineers, and Apple does a fair amount of hiring from that class. If that's your thing...)
Like I said, though, it's a computer science curriculum, not a "programming" or "web startup" curriculum. Everything you need to create a successful web startup you can probably teach yourself (c.f. Zuckerberg).
"Newer technologies" are offered, particularly in the CS193 classes. I wouldn't waste my time on them though; you can learn as much by reading documentation online. (The exception is the class on Objective-C and Cocoa. Final projects are presented to Apple engineers, and Apple does a fair amount of hiring from that class. If that's your thing...)
Like I said, though, it's a computer science curriculum, not a "programming" or "web startup" curriculum. Everything you need to create a successful web startup you can probably teach yourself (c.f. Zuckerberg).
"as well as at least the option to learn newer technologies (AJAX, stuff used in web startups)"
Don't bother. Learn to program, don't learn a language or a technology.
You can (and should!) do AJAX+RoR on your own. Learn how to think about programming.
I loved MIT. But I also went XVI (aero eng) because I've always felt that a direct approach is a mistake. I got to learn about rockets and aircraft and learn how to apply CS by taking all of those classes too.
Don't bother. Learn to program, don't learn a language or a technology.
You can (and should!) do AJAX+RoR on your own. Learn how to think about programming.
I loved MIT. But I also went XVI (aero eng) because I've always felt that a direct approach is a mistake. I got to learn about rockets and aircraft and learn how to apply CS by taking all of those classes too.
Harvard's CS department seems pretty decent (dedicated, interesting students; a variety of challenging courses; etc) to me, though as a non-CS-concentrator myself, I'm probably not the best one for advice. :) Also, I'm not sure whether you'll find much in the way of Ajax or similar technologies, but I'm far from convinced that you really want to take courses in that sort of thing. I was somewhat unimpressed with the intro theory course--would have been better to walk down the street and take Sipser's course at MIT.
As you mentioned, one big thing to consider is what you are interested in besides CS, what other types of students you want to hang out with, etc. College, at least at good American schools, is generally less about preparation for a career, and more about personal growth and exploration.
Finally, I imagine Stanford has somewhat better weather than Boston. :)
As you mentioned, one big thing to consider is what you are interested in besides CS, what other types of students you want to hang out with, etc. College, at least at good American schools, is generally less about preparation for a career, and more about personal growth and exploration.
Finally, I imagine Stanford has somewhat better weather than Boston. :)
I am currently studying as a grad student in the Computer Science dept of the San Jose State University, and I came here looking for the same things you are...am a little disappointed I have to say :(.
I say check to see more about the community you will find at the universities than the curriculum aspect IMHO.
MIT, though the CS students are probably somewhat less entrepreneurial than Stanford students on average.
From my experiences, I would discount most CS programs. Software Engineering may be a better fit for what you're describing, especially the entrepreneurial part.
I attend the Rochester Institute of Technology, and the Software Engineering curriculum here is top-notch. I would not hesitate to recommend it.
I attend the Rochester Institute of Technology, and the Software Engineering curriculum here is top-notch. I would not hesitate to recommend it.
Brown University
Any particular reason?
No particular reasons...one of my siblings went there. I was never smart enough to even think of applying to this Ivy...
The CS program has a reputation
Brown attracts a very, diverse interesting intellectual student body (and liberal)
Randy Pausch, who delivered a brilliant lecture about living life, (http://tinyurl.com/38zo2k) met his mentor there.
Most schools are liberal only in the term 'Liberal Arts' for the course catalog. Brown is so liberal they even protest against the computer system not allowing them register for classes whenever they want. See: http://www.brownalumnimagazine.com/july/august_2007/a_course...
Thayer Street (the main campus drag) is a wonder.
The CS program has a reputation
Brown attracts a very, diverse interesting intellectual student body (and liberal)
Randy Pausch, who delivered a brilliant lecture about living life, (http://tinyurl.com/38zo2k) met his mentor there.
Most schools are liberal only in the term 'Liberal Arts' for the course catalog. Brown is so liberal they even protest against the computer system not allowing them register for classes whenever they want. See: http://www.brownalumnimagazine.com/july/august_2007/a_course...
Thayer Street (the main campus drag) is a wonder.
If you think that other things are more important for a CS student, please let me know, as I'm shooting in the dark here and the above paragraph was basically a response to trying to avoid what I would not like.
So far, Stanford seems like my first choice. I appreciate any of your suggestions.